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#1 Greensboronclion

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 12:20 PM

I played round 3 at the OGT with my Logitech G602 Gaming mouse MS and hit 5/14 fairways and 15/18 greens and it says I used a forgiving device.  LMAO.  Now I have heard thru the grapevine this isnt working and that proves it but why does it show it on those numbers and trust me I was playing from the rough all day long with all that wind going on.  Just thought I would share and see if any others had seen that as its the second time I have ever seen it. 


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#2 Dazmaniac

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 12:39 PM

Where did the 'grapevine' get their info?



#3 ✠ davef ✠

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 12:46 PM

did anyone try to chat with you prior to your notice.

or do they just front people out in the open , or is this something you just see.

just wondering i don't belong over there just to busy for me.

maybe thats why i don't belong to sites like that hell we got enough people

in our business without letting more in, hell seems someone wants to use a computer to monitor just about everything we do

even playing games


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#4 zmax - sim

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 01:37 PM

That message can come up no matter where you play.  Can be on a tour round or just a normal round in the lobby.  It's a built in game feature and not controlled by any tour site.  

 

Being a tour site, we get that data on the api but choose to ignore most of it.   Our tests shows it gives a lot of false positives like with Greens above and there are straight devices that will never trigger it.


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#5 ✠ davef ✠

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 01:41 PM

oh ok thanks i have never seen it so i didn't know nothing about it


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#6 Armand

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 01:17 AM

Hmmm ... I thought this was disabled in one update a bit ago - or was that just the values that used to show in the console (you know, those values that most players never knew what they meant)?  Personally, I've never seen the message, but I don't play very often (471 hours; 333 rounds).



#7 DoGgs

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 06:24 AM

I played round 3 at the OGT with my Logitech G602 Gaming mouse MS and hit 5/14 fairways and 15/18 greens and it says I used a forgiving device.  LMAO.  Now I have heard thru the grapevine this isnt working and that proves it but why does it show it on those numbers and trust me I was playing from the rough all day long with all that wind going on.  Just thought I would share and see if any others had seen that as its the second time I have ever seen it.

 

 

You need to take it to the range and see how many dead straight hits you achieve with that mouse, you say all that wind going on.... Was it the wind taking you from the FW or was it wayward hitting?.  If you are hitting straight after straight it would not matter what the wind does, the alert would be triggered by shot making alone, nothing else. looks like you need a range visit.


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#8 Mike Jones

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 07:23 AM

That message can come up no matter where you play.  Can be on a tour round or just a normal round in the lobby.  It's a built in game feature and not controlled by any tour site.  

 

Being a tour site, we get that data on the api but choose to ignore most of it.   Our tests shows it gives a lot of false positives like with Greens above and there are straight devices that will never trigger it.

 

Would be interested in finding out what data you are basing your tests on. 

 

I can use the same mouse and unless I switch hardware snapping 'off' in the software (which is optional to install) I get a positive at the end of my round. There are many different types of controllers and mice but what cannot lie is the data we obtain from the standard deviation from a perfect path. We don't dictate to the people who play the game how they should play it but the warning when triggered let's the person know that they are more than likely using a control device which is easier than the game was designed with. 


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#9 frank70

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 08:00 AM

Would be interested in finding out what data you are basing your tests on. 

 

I can use the same mouse and unless I switch hardware snapping 'off' in the software (which is optional to install) I get a positive at the end of my round. There are many different types of controllers and mice but what cannot lie is the data we obtain from the standard deviation from a perfect path. We don't dictate to the people who play the game how they should play it but the warning when triggered let's the person know that they are more than likely using a control device which is easier than the game was designed with. 

Mike, i get the message maybe once or twice every 10 rounds. And most of the times, when i have really good round. If the detection would work properly, shouldn't the message appear every single time or it should never appear?

 

On top of that i have a mouse with angle snapping (which i stopped using for the game) and a mouse without it. The message pops up here and there with both mice. But as i said: 8 or 9 rounds not, 1 time out of 10 it does.

 

I use 1100 dpi setting for my swings and 1.0 sensitivity setting in game. That should be well in the "okay range", right?

 

Right now the message unsettles players, plays mind games. As long as it isn't consistent, it doesn't help imo.


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#10 MimicPS

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 08:37 AM

Hi Mike,

 

Good to see you come in on the topic.

 

I wonder if I could raise a possible issue as far as the 'forgiving device' message goes.

 

From data gathered when we have tried to find an equitable situation at PGLS as to when the data gets to a point where we have to start being more concerned about the equality of swing difficulties and whether a produced movement is outside of what the developers intended for the game, we have noticed that it seems much more likely to breach the level at which it happens when a player uses vertical motionswing when compared to horizontal motionswing. Is there any difference in the measurement of the two axis?


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#11 sideshowbob

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 09:31 AM

Like Frank, I get the message very occassionally (probably not as often as 1 in 10). I use vertical MS (Pro) with a Logitech G502 mouse. The only settings I have changed is to lower the DPI. i dont see this as a problem as I could achieve pretty much the same effect from within the Mouse Sensitivity settings in the game options.



#12 Mike Jones

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 11:14 AM

 

 

On top of that i have a mouse with angle snapping (which i stopped using for the game) and a mouse without it. The message pops up here and there with both mice. But as i said: 8 or 9 rounds not, 1 time out of 10 it does.

 

 

Angle snapping can be enabled in the hardware drivers by default it depends on the manufacturer. If you only get a positive message one out of 10 the chances are your mouse is on the 'borderline' and is perfectly acceptable for the task. If you were to get the positive message almost every time the chances that your controller is making the game easy would be considerably larger. 

 

It's up to the tours how they use the data they get and perhaps there would be a threshold about how often a player would be flagged as using an easy controller before any action was taken either by a warning from the tour or an imposed handicap.

 

Online gaming always throws up an uneven playing field - it's the nature of the beast. You can either accept it or play on LAN only with everyone using the same equipment in the same room.


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#13 Tigers Agent

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 11:15 AM

Occam's Razor   "the principle (attributed to William of Occam) that in explaining a thing, no more assumptions should be made than are necessary. The principle is often invoked to defend reductionism or nominalism."



#14 Greensboronclion

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 12:18 PM

You need to take it to the range and see how many dead straight hits you achieve with that mouse, you say all that wind going on.... Was it the wind taking you from the FW or was it wayward hitting?.  If you are hitting straight after straight it would not matter what the wind does, the alert would be triggered by shot making alone, nothing else. looks like you need a range visit.




DoGgz the G602 is a great gaming mouse and is not I repeat not a forgiving device like their controllers. I average about 70% greens and fairways whether calm or windy on average and for record I play it out of the box as is as I am not savoy enough to adjust. If I am off my timing or path with it I can assure you I go to to parts unknown and my scores show it. Lol. I have spent countless hours trying to perfect the perfect JNPG swing with a mouse and have yet to find that magic and that is with all the swings and forget RTSM as my caddie doesn't have enough balls in the bag to get us thru a round at TP. In conclusion it's not the mouse being the reason for the message as it isn't any better than my Corsair M65 RGB when it comes to my swing.

#15 ✠ davef ✠

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 12:51 PM

shows ya how much i know about cheating, what the heck is angle snapping


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#16 Greensboronclion

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 07:13 PM

shows ya how much i know about cheating, what the heck is angle snapping




Yeah Dave that was over my head also. I hear about all these cheating programs and other stuff and say to myself where do people find this stuff and where do they find the time.
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#17 Acrilix

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 07:25 PM

Angle snapping is found in gaming mouse software and sometimes built directly into the mouse's firmware to make it easier to move a mouse in a straight line.


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#18 Greensboronclion

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 02:31 AM

Angle snapping is found in gaming mouse software and sometimes built directly into the mouse's firmware to make it easier to move a mouse in a straight line.



My mouse must have been sleeping when they were passing it out at the factory as sometimes the only straight I get is straight to the rough.😂 lol.

#19 DivotMaker

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 03:21 PM

Angle snapping can be enabled in the hardware drivers by default it depends on the manufacturer. If you only get a positive message one out of 10 the chances are your mouse is on the 'borderline' and is perfectly acceptable for the task. If you were to get the positive message almost every time the chances that your controller is making the game easy would be considerably larger. 

 

It's up to the tours how they use the data they get and perhaps there would be a threshold about how often a player would be flagged as using an easy controller before any action was taken either by a warning from the tour or an imposed handicap.

 

Online gaming always throws up an uneven playing field - it's the nature of the beast. You can either accept it or play on LAN only with everyone using the same equipment in the same room.

 

A fact that few truly realize. A "level playing field" will NEVER exist in video games unless everyone playing is using the exact same equipment on the exact same network in the exact same room. 


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#20 Fairwayman

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Posted 20 August 2017 - 05:24 PM

Vertical MSwing Pro

I was getting it a lot when I played 250\250 x\y axis... no angle snapping in my G100s baseline Logitech gaming mouse.

Now moving to 1100 \1100..1 in  every 4 round

I applaud Mimic and PGLS for looking into this.  Very discouraging this algorithm\angle snapping can't distinguish between a mouse and controller for the message B)


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