34 replies to this topic

[Wilson]

Please change back to the old method of horizontal azimuth putting for SkyTrak users.
The game for me is unusable when all you can do is hope to hit it to gimme range and never ever scramble.
SkyTrak is just not sensitive enough for absolute HA alignment.

[Trip]

Can you explain what you mean by this? I'm new to PG so I don't know how it worked before. I have a skytrak and find putting in PG really hard - much harder than putting in real life.

[Wilson]

Previously the game seemed to ignore the horizontal readings, or significantly reduced the amount of left/right direction on putts. So you aligned the direction on screen, and it was about reading that start point and then speed.
Now, if you have bumpy carpet, or just the vagaries of SkyTrak's horizontal readings (even 1* at 8ft is a miss) then things goes wickedly wrong as you know.

The device isn't good enough, and most hitting mats won't be ideal enough to really just let it fly as the device pumps out a horizontal measurement. There's rumour that a fix is coming that has some type of sliding scale - so they reduce the alignment reading by 10x at 5 feet, 5 times at 10 feet etc.
So if the Unit reads 4.5* left off the putter face, at 5 feet it will instead simulate 0.5*
At 10 feet it would simulate 0.9*
At least, thats how i read the rumour. I wish it would just be a setting to disable horizontal altogether in putting. When friends play etc for fun it should just be about direction and speed.

[hoganwoods]

Wilson, on 16 May 2016 - 7:43 PM, said:

Previously the game seemed to ignore the horizontal readings, or significantly reduced the amount of left/right direction on putts. So you aligned the direction on screen, and it was about reading that start point and then speed.
Now, if you have bumpy carpet, or just the vagaries of SkyTrak's horizontal readings (even 1* at 8ft is a miss) then things goes wickedly wrong as you know.

The device isn't good enough, and most hitting mats won't be ideal enough to really just let it fly as the device pumps out a horizontal measurement. There's rumour that a fix is coming that has some type of sliding scale - so they reduce the alignment reading by 10x at 5 feet, 5 times at 10 feet etc.
So if the Unit reads 4.5* left off the putter face, at 5 feet it will instead simulate 0.5*
At 10 feet it would simulate 0.9*
At least, thats how i read the rumour. I wish it would just be a setting to disable horizontal altogether in putting. When friends play etc for fun it should just be about direction and speed.

I believe the scale is already implemented and being tested this week.

[Wilson]

*crickets*

[zmax - sim]

Wilson, on 24 May 2016 - 1:43 PM, said:

*crickets*

 

Now that the new putting is out, you have no comments?

[Wilson]

I didn't know it was fixed?

[johnmeyer]

Update was pushed yesterday, maybe even the night before cant remember. 

[Trip]

Is there any detail available about what has been changed?

[Chughes82]

I am very happy with PG. Started working my way through Q school tonight. This is a genuine question, not a criticism veiled as a question. Does PG green speed seem faster than real life stimp speeds?

I am putting to what in real life seems like would be less than half the putt distance on the PG greens,yet the putt is still usually long in PG. In other words, if PG shows a 26 foot putt, I putt to what I think would be about 10-12 feet irl and often the putt is still long, even when the drop is only 2 inches downhill.

Again, I am not bashing PG. I really like it and am very happy with it. Just wondering if others perceive green speed similarly.

[Trip]

Chughes82, I feel exactly the same about putting in PG as you do. Are you using a skytrak?

 

It's possible that because I'm putting on a golf mat rather than an actual green that my perception is wrong. It's also true that the greens I'm used to do not run at 10 on the stimp (I played yesterday and they were 8.5).

 

PG apparently implements formula 32 from this article to determine the putting distance (by setting Vf = 0). Maybe that formula is wrong, or maybe it's not implemented correctly. See this thread where I took some measurements in PG which I'm hoping to replicate on a real green as soon as sky golf tell me how to set putting mode on the skytrak outside of PG.

 

Like you, I really like this game and I'm not bashing it. I'm interested to get to the bottom of the issue though, even if it just turns out my putting is dreadful

[Armand]

I'm not a sim player, but I'm wondering if the putting speed is because of the stimp setting in the game?  Most courses that people play on usually have stimps at 10 or less, I believe.  If your stimp settings are at 12 -14, that could explain why your putts are all going longer than you expect.  (Just a thought - not trying to imply everything is perfect with the game!)

[Dropzone73]

Place a very fast putting carpet to your simulation floor and have enough room to try for example 6 yard put. Find a flat put in JNPG and compare the results with different stimp settings.

I am also a SkyTak user and I know it feels different to put inside against impact screen. I haven't tested this myself, but I think it will surprice how little power is needed to 6 yard put.

[zmax - sim]

GC2 beta testers tested JNPG's stimps extensively and they were all spot on.  Most local golf courses are less than stimp 10.  Your putting carpet is also probably slower than 10.

 

There's a thread in OGT Beta testers section that covered all this and included all the math.  I'll make it public if I can find it....

[Chughes82]

Thanks for all the replies. (I am using Skytrak, game stimp setting 10) I have a putting mat that is supposed to run at 10-11, but I haven't used it to test against PG. I should've done that before posting. I'm used to putting on greens irl that are between 10-12, so I was basing my commentary on feel. As I learned when I first got the Skytrak, there is definitely an adjustment to indoor play, so this is probably just user error. I'll likely be unable to play for about a week, but I will test more accurately against the putting mat and report back.

[Trip]

I updated the spreadsheet I populated with test putts to convert to metric and compare the distance in PG with the formula, and it seems that PG does indeed use the formula correctly. Results here.

 

So either that formula is wrong, or my perception is wrong, or - and this seems plausible since it's ST users seeing a problem - skytrak is not measuring ball speed properly in putting mode. Tests are needed.

 

Can anyone expand on the putting modification that's just been applied, ie. what's changed?

[zmax - sim]

The amount of forgiveness in HLA for putts is dependent on the distance to the hole.   The shorter the distance, the more forgiveness.  Short distances are the most difficult for Skytrak to read properly.

[Trip]

Ok, interesting, thanks. Funnily enough I already find it unrealistically easy to get the line right on a level putt in PG, but very difficult to judge weight.

[Chughes82]

I would like to rescind my earlier post about green speeds being faster than advertised. I spent a few minutes putting on a putting mat with advertised stimp of 10-11, though I can't vouch for the actual stimp. Putting at distances of 5 to 9 feet (the max length of the mat), the JNPG/Skytrak distances were consistently 3 to 12 inches short of the real putts, even with JNPG set to stimp of 12 and 14.

Wish I had done this before posting yesterday. I can't really speak to the 25 to 35 foot putts in the game, but I feel much more confident in the accuracy of the software/hardware after my experiment. As with many things in my golf game, I'll confirm this as user error.

[zmax - sim]

How do you feel about the putt start direction in the game?