40 replies to this topic

[Acrilix]

I thought PP had already said that they couldn't release most of their courses shown on Sky because of EASport's exclusive PGATour license. Or did I dream this?

I don't imagine that they could simply rename them and release them anyway when they have already provided video evidence to a tv company that they are supposed to be the real courses.

[frank70]

Acrilix, on 10 Dec 2015 - 10:26 AM, said:

I thought PP had already said that they couldn't release most of their courses shown on Sky because of EASport's exclusive PGATour license. Or did I dream this?

I don't imagine that they could simply rename them and release them anyway when they have already provided video evidence to a tv company that they are supposed to be the real courses.

So they have special agreements with Sawgrass, Medinah, Boston etc. but still have to name them differently? I don't quite understand the benefit for this courses.

 

Would that include legal problems for user creations of real golf courses within the game as well? Maybe that would be one reason, why they won't host the files on their own servers.

 

If not, they just should send the files of the real courses to our creative designers and let them release the courses under their flag  . Just kidding.

[Acrilix]

frank70, on 10 Dec 2015 - 1:27 PM, said:

Would that include legal problems for user creations of real golf courses within the game as well? Maybe that would be one reason, why they won't host the files on their own servers.

 

There have always been legal problems for user creations of real courses, but the chance of anyone taking legal action over something that is being distributed for free has been seen as so small that most designers have taken the risk to proceed anyway. Of course, with the 'free' courses now requiring a fee to play them under PP's subscription proposal this is possibly a new grey area, but one that I presume PP has looked at and decided they are safe to proceed with as they will be neither supplying or producing the unlicensed courses. I presume all the risk will still be with the designers.

As to hosting the files, HB Studios host real courses on their TGC servers created by their users, but will not put any of the real named ones on their 'suggested list', presumably because these are available to play offline too or because that would be endorsing an illegal product. Who knows what the legality of this all is until someone actually challenges it in the courts? Certainly not me! 

[Buck]

Golf is a sport on life support in the USA.
These courses should be doing all the deals they can if you ask me.

[axe360]

Personally I never did a PGA course but I did plenty of Real Public courses and I found it very challenging to try and recreate something on the computer that is actually in real life.. Of course, I started out just doing Fictional courses but after a while, one likes to see if he can recreate something that is out there.. There are so many Public courses with good overhead maps and hole layouts, you just watch. Once some of these guy's/gals get going, they will try one, sooner or later...

 

Right now, there trying go get a handle on the tools.. Then watch out...

[Trath]

Driverdivots you have got to see the irony in real versus fictional courses (just like the irony in all the pay to play threads when it comes to paying for entertainment). Real life course were also the figment of a course designers imagination before being built.

 

And the logic of saying things are "right" or "not right" doesn't make sense unless you are simply trying to replicate something else (anything else).

 

But I am sure there are designers that would relish the challenge of faithfully recreating an existing course in minute detail, and those that would prefer the creative and conceptual process of designing their own.

[TimBoch]

Almost all of my courses have been real courses. So if I can help in any way I will. I have 4 courses layed out in various stages of planting, but feel they have to much to do to even release them as a beta. I also haven't converted them to the updated version of CF. So my progress has been slow.

[worrybirdie]

Acrilix, on 10 Dec 2015 - 2:37 PM, said:

There have always been legal problems for user creations of real courses, but the chance of anyone taking legal action over something that is being distributed for free has been seen as so small that most designers have taken the risk to proceed anyway. Of course, with the 'free' courses now requiring a fee to play them under PP's subscription proposal this is possibly a new grey area, but one that I presume PP has looked at and decided they are safe to proceed with as they will be neither supplying or producing the unlicensed courses. I presume all the risk will still be with the designers.

As to hosting the files, HB Studios host real courses on their TGC servers created by their users, but will not put any of the real named ones on their 'suggested list', presumably because these are available to play offline too or because that would be endorsing an illegal product. Who knows what the legality of this all is until someone actually challenges it in the courts? Certainly not me! 

I fear that requiring a fee to play free courses will make them not free, and all of the legal restrictions will kick in. I am not a lawyer, and hope I'm wrong, but its been my impression based on other attempts to use copyrighted material in a game. If so, this is one of the main drawbacks to the subscription system.

[Crow357]

worrybirdie, on 15 Dec 2015 - 8:49 PM, said:

I fear that requiring a fee to play free courses will make them not free, and all of the legal restrictions will kick in. I am not a lawyer, and hope I'm wrong, but its been my impression based on other attempts to use copyrighted material in a game. If so, this is one of the main drawbacks to the subscription system.

Well, apcd-courses charged a fee to download "free" courses.  Maybe it's not a big deal.  /shrug.

[M Rose]

If I can ever figure out the terrain tools, I plan on doing plenty of real courses, even if I have to rename it.

[worrybirdie]

Crow357, on 15 Dec 2015 - 8:57 PM, said:

Well, apcd-courses charged a fee to download "free" courses.  Maybe it's not a big deal.  /shrug.

Were they real courses that they used on the tour? Because that's what I was referring to.

[frank70]

A rendition of Augusta National right in time for the Masters would be great. A Major at OGT or by then at Perfect Parallel on the real venue ..... drooling!!!

[Acrilix]

frank70, on 06 Feb 2016 - 5:49 PM, said:

A rendition of Augusta National right in time for the Masters would be great. A Major at OGT or by then at Perfect Parallel on the real venue ..... drooling!!!

 

If PP can't release it they should pass the file on to someone like Dr. Rob to update it and release as a user created course. 

[frank70]

They should do that with all their courses they have in stock from their tv work :-) . Every week a tourney on a real venue!! And we could have a parallel tour on all the wonderful fictional courses. One can dream :-)

[Ricky Proffer]

frank70, on 06 Feb 2016 - 7:33 PM, said:

They should do that with all their courses they have in stock from their tv work :-) . Every week a tourney on a real venue!! And we could have a parallel tour on all the wonderful fictional courses. One can dream :-)

I saw Mike playing Augusta in the lobby the other day.  

[slouis]

Renditions based on real courses are the most popular by far over at the download site for TW 08 courses.  For the most downloaded courses, 28 of the top 30 are based on real courses and no surprise that number one is Augusta by Ken McHale which dates way back to 2007.

[M Rose]

As others have said, most of the tour courses have been made by PP already, it's just a matter of copyright and clearance issues. I think EA may have had exclusive rights to several of them (mostly the TPCs) at one time, but I don't know the whole deal. I'd let the devs speak for themselves on that subject.

 

In the meantime some of us are working on some notable courses outside of the tour venues.

[frank70]

Has any of the designers or of course the devs news about this topic? Is it even allowed to put recreations in the game? And how could there be a way to do it? PP has at least the correct (lidar?) data - could they share the data for free and some designers could work with that?

 

It would be absolutely great to play the real venues at OGT. Imagine: First i play a round in the game and then i can watch the real pros how they fare on the same track. That simply would be fantastic for me!

[#GCW]

Slewin is going to work on Augusta, see 'Augusta' thread

[worrybirdie]

Its my impression that licensing issues become difficult to prosecute if no one is making money. That's why the oft mentioned TW course site coursedownloads.com has gotten away with it.