241 replies to this topic

[Ron Piskorik]

Have you paid for user courses? I wasn't aware that anyone was charging for them.

 

Yes we didn't have to pay for the courses themselves but we had the ability to play user designed courses when we purchased the game.  The ability to play them came included with the game.  Now it sounds like we will not be able to play them without paying for DLC that we will never use.  That is taking away a feature that was included with the basic game.  I also feel that it is not a very good way to increase future support for the game.

[Dazmaniac]

Have you paid for user courses? I wasn't aware that anyone was charging for them.

Correct. But read the latest Steam update referred to in earlier posts in this thread and it states that future Milestone DLC will need to be purchased to allow you to continue play user created courses.

Without it, any user courses will be unplayable and only courses that are part of the game or purchased DLC courses will be playable.

[JoeF]

"Those choosing to not keep the game up to date with the new DLC will continue to be able to use Perfect Golf with all the content they have purchased or we have released as free DLC or was included with the game but user courses will no longer work with older versions of the game."

 

The way this is worded I take it that if we don't keep our game up to date with the latest purchased DLC, we will be losing something that we already have paid for.  I am hoping that this is just poorly worded.  We should be able to play all the user created courses that were compatible with the last version that we purchased.  Why should I have to purchase a new version with a career mode if I will never use the career mode just to keep playing the user courses that I already have?

 

I think we need a clarification from the developers.

 

If we don't update to the latest paid DLC version of the game, will we not be able to play any user courses with the version we are currently using?

 

If the answer is yes, I hope that PP will consider not doing this.  I am hoping that they don't intend to do this and have not thought about all the negative implications of taking away something that we have already paid for.

 

Pray tell, Ron, what content did you pay for that will not be available after a paid DLC upgrade to the game?  

[remers]

Can I dev please step in with a clear and concise statement to nip yet another DLC thread in the bud?

[Richard]

Can I dev please step in with a clear and concise statement to nip yet another DLC thread in the bud?

 

I think the developers have already made their clear and concise statement. Certain game upgrades will be DLC and to continue to play user courses you need to purchase the upgrade. Pretty straightforward to me. The question is now whether or not I and others want to participate.

[Jperkules]

I do believe that the statement was pretty clear.

When Significant/Milestone DLC is released, things that are basically a 1.5 or 2.0 version of the game, then that DLC will need to be purchased to continue to play user created courses.

It's not for all DLC or minor upgrades, but for significant upgrades, which basically move the game forward....like going from TW08 to TW8.5 or TW9.

Just for me personally, I am not affected.

However....

I do believe, in my humble opinion, that this is the wrong approach, for the reasons that others are stating above.

It's like what Mike said about courses, when asked if a user creates a course that will be released as a licensed course, will that user course be prohibited, etc.  Mike said that it is then their job to make sure the licensed course is worth purchasing, that they need to do a good enough job.

It's the same with future DLC, just make it worth buying, and the loyal fans here will purchase.

With the described business model, there is risk of alienating some fans.

I don't think the reward is worth the risk. 

[remers]

Fair enough, must have mis-read/misunderstood so not quite clear enough for my simple mind but that's my problem.

[zmax - sim]

I do believe that the statement was pretty clear.

When Significant/Milestone DLC is released, things that are basically a 1.5 or 2.0 version of the game, then that DLC will need to be purchased to continue to play user created courses.

It's not for all DLC or minor upgrades, but for significant upgrades, which basically move the game forward....like going from TW08 to TW8.5 or TW9.

Just for me personally, I am not affected.

 

 

That's exactly how I read it.  I'm going to predict that these milestone DLC(significant game updates) will probably come once or every other year and will probably cost $10-20 each time.   

 

This is not a big deal IMO. PP says this is needed to help continue fund the development of the game and I believe them.

[bortimus]

I still think that course creators should have access to their own work at any time (no updates necessary)

Just sayin'

[JoeF]

I still think that course creators should have access to their own work at any time (no updates necessary)

Just sayin'

 

Who's to say that user course creators won't receive a free update as a thanks for their efforts in support of the game?

[Sliceapottomus]

Nobody's twisting anybody's arms here... If some thing is up for purchase you have the choice to buy it. It really is that simple. If you don't like it don't buy IT !!!!! geesh

[bortimus]

JoeF, you're right, I don't know if free updates would be available for course creators.

That doesn't address the issue of someone creating personal courses that aren't released.

[trailblazergolf]

i have always said i'll be glad to pay for GOOD courses--for example---TPC courses--major tour courses--and courses like troon--and others of equal quality -----AMEN--LOL----i think 3.00--to 6.00 be fair depending on quality of course

[Acrilix]

Nobody's twisting anybody's arms here... If some thing is up for purchase you have the choice to buy it. It really is that simple. If you don't like it don't buy IT !!!!! geesh

 

That's a pretty ignorant statement.

I think that plenty of arms are going to be twisted by this when courses that people enjoy playing just disappear from their game one day in the future.

[Ron Piskorik]

Pray tell, Ron, what content did you pay for that will not be available after a paid DLC upgrade to the game?  

 

Yes we didn't have to pay for the courses themselves but we had the ability to play user designed courses when we purchased the game.  The ability to play them came included with the game.  Now it sounds like we will not be able to play them without paying for DLC that we will never use.  That is taking away a feature that was included with the basic game.  I also feel that it is not a very good way to increase future support for the game.

 

I just have the feeling like some others here is that it is like a hidden way to force people to buy features that they will never use like career mode and improved AI.  I will never use those features but I will be forced to buy them when they are added to the game to keep the ability to play user created courses.  I really don't care about the money and will continue to support the game.  I just don't agree with the business model.

 

I was a alpha tester and haven't paid anything for the game.  I am expressing how I would have felt if I purchased the game and six months later I wouldn't be able to play user created courses when that ability was there when I purchased the game.  I don't think I would be very pleased with the way PP had treated me as a customer.  

[FreeBolt]

I have not played the game as long as most of you have, but I have a great time playing, So paying 20-30 or what ever it may be for game updates for a year is fine.

[JCat04]

What is being called milestone updates was always going to be a tough row to hoe for Perfect Parallel.  I'm of the opinion that if you do offer something that adds or changes a game feature significantly enough, it should come with a cost.  I'm not sure it should render something you were able to use before inoperable though.  Let's say for example that PP made 3-D rough textures available as DLC, and you had to pay $5 to access it for all courses that use it going forward.  It shouldn't make the user created courses already in existence, that don't and can't use 3-D rough anyway, inoperable to those who don't purchase the milestone DLC.  OTOH, I can see where it would make future user created courses that did use the milestone update 3-D, off limits to people who did not purchase milestone 3-D DLC.

 

It's too easy to get our panties in a wad over something we don't yet fully understand but are willing to speculate upon.  I'm not going to get worked up over $5 to $20 bucks here and there if it keeps JNPG up to date with where a JNPG 2 new release edition would have been anyway two years down the road anyway.  I don't see this as a shakedown by PP.  They're trying to outline the basis for a business model that will keep them going with an acceptable ROI.  At least they're being up front about it.

[LeazesNDR]

I'm a big fan of the game and what the folks at Perfect Parallel are trying to do.
That said, there is a post on the golf club forums that suggests that Perfect Parallel need a marketing consultant. I'm inclined to agree, unfortunately.

[zmax - sim]

I'm a big fan of the game and what the folks at Perfect Parallel are trying to do.
That said, there is a post on the golf club forums that suggests that Perfect Parallel need a marketing consultant. I'm inclined to agree, unfortunately.

 

 

Do that and they'll have to raise prices on DLC to pay for the consultant.

[JoeF]

So, hypothetically speaking, down the road if PG was to announce a "milestone" update that included major changes to the underlying game engine and Unity version, which caused an incompatibility with existing user made courses (which could only be rectified by PG making a tweak to those existing courses to make them compatible with the new version of the game) rendering them incompatible with the older version of the game,  then PG should not move forward with said update since there may be those who would be unwilling to upgrade their old version in order to remain compatible with the courses and to take advantage of what may, theoretically, be a groundbreaking update to the game.  

 

Sorry, but that doesn't get my vote.