43 replies to this topic

[zmax - sim]

TM, the new owner of PP(JNPG) has decided to stop selling new JNPG annual simulator subscriptions to Skytrak. Current Skytrak JNPG subscribers can continue to renew indefinitely.

But come June 19th, Skytrak will no longer sell jnpg annual sim subscriptions. If you want to use jnpg, you must buy the sim subscription by June 18th.

[Jperkules]

This sucks royal

[Jperkules]

I wish tm never purchased perfect golf. Life was good within this realm a few years ago.

[Jperkules]

This also means i care a whole lot less about pg2 if im not going to be able to ise it on skytrak, and i aint forking over 12k for a tm unit.

[Jperkules]

In all sincerity though, thank you for the honest news, i guess i can keep renewing pg1 for awhile

[zmax - sim]

Crazy news indeed for Skytrak users. Perhaps renew again till we know more about PG2. Who knows... you might have to upgrade your LM.

[Buck]

I hate to say it guys, but I'm not surprised a bit.

 

TM bought PG to benefit TM hardware users..

 

It obviously sucks for non TM Sim users, but honestly from a business standpoint it's completely what one would expect.

 

Trackman isn't just a new owner, they make competing hardware (which has what looks to be hefty margins) and they clearly want the complete hardware + software synergistic offering - sort of ala Apple with their OS + Hardware combos.

[Buck]

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[DPRoberts]

A lot to read between the lines on this one. Would be a bummer to lose such a great simulator experience of lidar accurate courses because it no longer pairs with your hardware.

It would seem logical that TM would move JNPG to being only compatible with TM devices if they are truly the "owners" of the game at the moment.

An interesting point is that probably very few people purchase a launch monitor solely because of the software available. I would think it is more that people search a certain hardware and wonder what software can played with it.

I purchased a GC2 because I believed it represented the launch monitor with the greatest accuracy in a confined space without particular lighting setup requirements. It is virtually plug and play. It has proven to be such a great device.

At initial purchase, I bought FSX because I wasn't sure if I could really get TGC to work. After learning a bit through golfsimulatorforum, I purchased TGC and ultimately settled in with JNPG.

None of the software really controlled the initial decision to purchase. My point is that I don't think 10 percent of the 200+ OGT members will suddenly purchase a TM launch monitor to keep their ability to play JNPG.

As long as a back door remains open on TGC with GSX, the majority of GC2ers head that way. Skytrak owners can head to E6golf.

Ultimately, TM doesn't care about our miniscule numbers here. It's about selling a package with their launch monitor. I wasted 2k on FSX. Plenty of TM owners, from golf clubs, practice facilities, to home studios will shell out for a simulation package and outdo any little number our sim community can muster.

I would probably consider jumping if there was any way to get indoor accuracy because I like the club path data but you need way too much ball flight for TM indoors.

Enjoy it while it lasts! Hopefully, when you renew you're at least entitled to a full year regardless of changes. Makes me think they would need to give a 1 year heads up on end of PG1. Anyone read the fine print??

[Buck]

Ultimately, TM doesn't care about our miniscule numbers here. It's about selling a package with their launch monitor. 

 

That's really the synopsis right there.

[Stingreye]

That's really the synopsis right there.

I am not sure what they are thinking..... if it was only about marrying it to their TM unit they would have killed PG2 and PG1 when TM's Virtual golf was released.  Not sure what their plans are.   

[Buck]

I am not sure what they are thinking..... if it was only about marrying it to their TM unit they would have killed PG2 and PG1 when TM's Virtual golf was released.  Not sure what their plans are.   

 

I think it's possible that it's only about marrying the Sim user to a TM unit.

There is a whole different world and gaming market to be a part of on the PC (and maybe consoles).

 

There's a business opportunity there that has potential, and that's also the area where you'd likely want to keep things going to continually foster and grow a 3rd party course, and perhaps other content, ecosystem.

 

Know what I mean?

 

I just think when it comes to the golden goose of what they do (Sim hardware), they want to ensure they are capturing 100% of PG usage on their own hardware.  What people do with other input methods is A.  Not as lucrative,  B.  Has beneficial synergies that could align with TM Sim usage, C.  Might get people interested in upgrading to a TM setup, etc

 

Contrast that with Sim usage on non TM hardware.  There's not a lot they are bringing to the table for TM short of simple PG annual fees, which they can get + TM hardware margin, by driving those people in house.

 

All in all - this is likely part of a plan for the future and less about what people have been doing with PG (now TM) software in the past.

[zmax - sim]

DPRoberts,

 

This news concerns Skytrak new subs only.  The generic BT sim pass is not affected.   After June 19th, potential skytrak users will go with TGC, e6, or other software options.  

 

In my estimates, there are 5-700  JNPG subscribers.  Only 240 or so are on OGT.   And you're right, less than 10% of the 5-700 will even consider getting a $20+K TM4 with a $1000 per year update sub(includes TM PG).  Skytrak users have modest sim setups and costs.  They are definitely not potential TM4 buyers.

 

Perhaps something else is going on here because this TM decision makes zero sense.  If TM didn't want anybody else using JNPG, then why not just terminate all current annual subs as well once they are up for renewal?  

 

Also, the TM Virtual Golf (PG with PG2 UI) is a stand alone, watered down version of JNPG.  Not connected to steam, can't play on 3rd party tours, and not sure if it can even do online multiplayer.    

[Buck]

Skytrak users have modest sim setups and costs.  They are definitely not potential TM4 buyers.

 
Honestly sounds to me like they are just wanting to stay up market only for their Sim product, hardware and software combined.

 

If TM didn't want anybody else using JNPG, then why not just terminate all current annual subs as well once they are up for renewal?

 
Perhaps they will and we are only in early stages of changes?

[shimonko]

This news concerns Skytrak new subs only.  The generic BT sim pass is not affected.   After June 19th, potential skytrak users will go with TGC, e6, or other software options.  

Actually SkyTrak is notably missing from the list of about 8 launch monitors in the E6 Connect setup screen. Early days of course.

[shimonko]

I hate to say it guys, but I'm not surprised a bit.
 
TM bought PG to benefit TM hardware users..
 
It obviously sucks for non TM Sim users, but honestly from a business standpoint it's completely what one would expect.
 
Trackman isn't just a new owner, they make competing hardware (which has what looks to be hefty margins) and they clearly want the complete hardware + software synergistic offering - sort of ala Apple with their OS + Hardware combos.

Very different target markets, so I wouldn't call it competing hardware.

If Trackman release a low-cost device more along the pricing of the Flightscope Xi+, SkyTrak users may have something to upgrade to, but I'd be surprised if Trackman would choose to devalue their brand. It'd be like Ferrari releasing a $50k model. They're top dog and have fitters and instructors who knows advertising a Trackman, not GCQuad or Flightscope, brings them more business. 

[DPRoberts]

To Z, I was aware it is only Skytrak. I was only suggesting it should be a warning that none of us non-TM owners are necessarily safe.

Maybe the software companies decide to bump only the budget option launch monitors off their compatibility list. I don't know. I was bored and wanted to jump into the hypothesizing and theoreticals because it always ends so well around here.

Wish the GC2 could connect to E6golf. It's the only other big name golf sim software that I've not tried. Maybe it can through GSX...

[zmax - sim]

Wish the GC2 could connect to E6golf. It's the only other big name golf sim software that I've not tried. Maybe it can through GSX...

 

It can connect unofficially thru GSX.   I've had it.   IMO, e6 sucks compared to JNPG in just about every way.   Last I checked, cost was $2500-4000 depending on how many courses you want.   e6 connect looks great and might be worth looking into if it ever comes out...

[mebby]

If they've made this decision then it's only the first shoe to drop.  I'd imagine there will be other similar moves to come soon.  It makes ALL the sense if the world for them to focus their resources on the areas that make them money... and most of those areas don't mean a whole heck of a lot to the regular forum members here.  

 

I can't blame them.  It's just business.

[Stingreye]

If they've made this decision then it's only the first shoe to drop.  I'd imagine there will be other similar moves to come soon.  It makes ALL the sense if the world for them to focus their resources on the areas that make them money... and most of those areas don't mean a whole heck of a lot to the regular forum members here.  

 

I can't blame them.  It's just business.

Yes but my feeling is that PC/Console players are likely going to keep access.  Otherwise just kill off the PG name and use the already released with a better userinterface Trackman Virtual Golf.

 

You can see the skinned PG1 in this video.

 

I will say the new UI does look nice.