159 replies to this topic

[bortimus]

It's a potential game-balance issue.

Potential, yet already being talked about as if it were true.  A bit premature. 

 

If an RTS-C player wins a match or a tournament, they already have a cloud of suspicion over them.  Silly.   

[DivotMaker]

It's a potential game imbalance.

You don't think there will be some users better at one interface over the other? Please tell me this is not what you are saying as this has been the case since the beginning of computer Golf. You cannot judge any interface by using a small number of folks to measure this with. The vast majority of Golf games have had two or more swing mechanisms and I have NEVER in my 25 years playing Golf games have I ever seen both swings deliver equal results because there are HUMANS utilizing the interfaces. You could do this with machines, but we are not machines.

[tlvx]

Funny, with the statements you are making, what credibility any of your statements had are long gone. Feel free to prove everyone else differently.....

 

Tell us how you really feel.

[Dazmaniac]

Very funny. If you want a game, I'll give you a game. But, don't say you weren't warned.

What was the result of this match then?

Bortimus replied he was willing to play, though it had little to do with the point he was trying to make.

[bortimus]

I got scared and ran away to enjoy the weather outside.

Not sure what the match is for either...

[mebby]

I got scared and ran away to enjoy the weather outside.

Not sure what the match is for either...

Oh man!!  I thought maybe you were busy searching for all those reports of people having wild success with RTSC!!  Dang.

 

For the record - I did a search and most everything I read related to people banging their heads against a wall trying to figure out how to either putt with RTSC or how to hit a shot on plane so that they at least getting 50ish% FIR stats.

 

I had real trouble finding anyone claiming that RTSC was much easier for them than what they were using before.  I DID however notice that 3C players seem to be dominating the leaderboards over at OTG for whatever that's worth. 

[Crusher]

Well it doesn't feel realistic as it is... so the latter, but not everyone swings with the same tempo IRL do they?

 

Sorry Steven.  This alluding to feeling like "real life" with a computer video game is just not possible.  I think what everyone means when they say "feels like" real life is the visual experience, not moving or clicking a mouse.

 

It's a computer video game.  If anyone want's a more real life experience they would literally need setup the big screen with real clubs and smack the ball into the screen. Simulated golf in that form is as close to a real feeling of playing golf other than actually being outside on a real golf course.

 

PC golf is so far away from being real in terms of the physical experience, but it's very close for the visual experience.

[mebby]

Sorry Steven.  This alluding to feeling like "real life" with a computer video game is just not possible (to be polite).  I think what everyone means when they say "feels like" real life is the visual experience, not moving or clicking a mouse.

 

C'mon man. It's a computer game.

I respectfully disagree.  Yes, while using 3C there is absolutely no FEEL what-so-ever.  But using MS and RTSM I definitely sense a feel of rhythm and tempo and all those things.  It's certainly no where what you get in real life but there's certainly an aspect of feel.

 

There's also an aspect of feel with RTSC.  I can manipulate my swing to achieve different outcomes.  I KNOW without even looking at the screen if I've pulled of a good swing or not.  And sometimes I feel like I hit a great shot when I really did not... all things that happen to me on the real golf course with real clubs.

[Richard]

Thread cleanup #2. Next time, I hide the whole topic.

[Crusher]

I respectfully disagree.  Yes, while using 3C there is absolutely no FEEL what-so-ever.  But using MS and RTSM I definitely sense a feel of rhythm and tempo and all those things.  It's certainly no where what you get in real life but there's certainly an aspect of feel.

 

There's also an aspect of feel with RTSC.  I can manipulate my swing to achieve different outcomes.  I KNOW without even looking at the screen if I've pulled of a good swing or not.  And sometimes I feel like I hit a great shot when I really did not... all things that happen to me on the real golf course with real clubs.

 

Well.  Our minds can be magical and if moving a mouse gives you a sense of "real golf" then so be it.

[mebby]

Well.  Our minds can be magical and if moving a mouse gives you a sense of "real golf" then so be it.

I didn't say it gave me a sense of real golf I said it gave me a sense of feel.  Two distinctly different things.

[Crusher]

Like I said, the mind can be magical. 

[mebby]

Like I said, the mind can be magical. 

So... what are you trying to say exactly?  Because it sounds like you're making an underhanded insult.  If so - just come on out with it.

[frank70]

Potential, yet already being talked about as if it were true.  A bit premature. 

 

If an RTS-C player wins a match or a tournament, they already have a cloud of suspicion over them.  Silly.   

They don't have a cloud of suspicion over them - but stats don't lie. This thread originally started talking about the balance in difficulty between the different swing mechanics.

 

In the recent OGT tourney (great job by the way Bortimus!!!) the participating RTS-C players have put up FIR stats that were way over the average. As you know, the course had really narrow fairways and the average FIR number was 53%. The four RTS-C players had an average of 75% (one of them had 91% !!). At least this number is an indication that hitting the ball straight might be easier with RTS-C than with the other control methods.

 

And if i understood the discussion correctly it makes a big difference which controller you use. This all makes me believe that it will be very difficult to create a level playing field - unless the devs are somehow able to put a tempo element into the RTS-C swing.

 

No problem for me at the moment. The field is close together right now in the tourneys. But i remember the days when four or five MS players were always ahead of the rest of the field. And if we see this again something should be changed - not there yet.

[DivotMaker]

They don't have a cloud of suspicion over them - but stats don't lie. This thread originally started talking about the balance in difficulty between the different swing mechanics.
 
In the recent OGT tourney (great job by the way Bortimus!!!) the participating RTS-C players have put up FIR stats that were way over the average. As you know, the course had really narrow fairways and the average FIR number was 53%. The four RTS-C players had an average of 75% (one of them had 91% !!). At least this number is an indication that hitting the ball straight might be easier with RTS-C than with the other control methods.
 
And if i understood the discussion correctly it makes a big difference which controller you use. This all makes me believe that it will be very difficult to create a level playing field - unless the devs are somehow able to put a tempo element into the RTS-C swing.
 
No problem for me at the moment. The field is close together right now in the tourneys. But i remember the days when four or five MS players were always ahead of the rest of the field. And if we see this again something should be changed - not there yet.

I disagree that RTS-C is easy to straight. A handful may be doing very well with it, the majority of plans are struggling to hit straight. I have played virtually every Golf game released since 1990 and I can hold my own with analog swing interfaces in other games. RTS-C is the best swing interface I have seen in many years and I feel it is WAY too early tand our sample size of users is far too small to start proclaiming the swing as too easy

[StoneComet]

I disagree that RTS-C is easy to straight. A handful may be doing very well with it, the majority of plans are struggling to hit straight. I have played virtually every Golf game released since 1990 and I can hold my own with analog swing interfaces in other games. RTS-C is the best swing interface I have seen in many years and I feel it is WAY too early tand our sample size of users is far too small to start proclaiming the swing as too easy

This is heavily reliant on which controller a user is using (At this time ; My bet is PP cleans it up). If I use my Logitech F310 controller I can hit the ball straight much easier than with my Xbox One controller. It's still to early to rely on the statistical averages when it comes to controller method in my opinion. Although the proper feedback for PP is invaluable.

[DivotMaker]

This is heavily reliant on which controller a user is using (At this time ; My bet is PP cleans it up). If I use my Logitech F310 controller I can hit the ball straight much easier than with my Xbox One controller. It's still to early to rely on the statistical averages when it comes to controller method in my opinion. Although the proper feedback for PP is invaluable.

Thanks, I appreciate your insights on this and I am using an Xbox One Elite controller....

[Greensboronclion]

Using the Speedlink XEOX Pro myself and it's pretty much like the F310 and I am hitting about 75% of the greens and fairways and still struggle to keep it at par and never problem with that using MS or 3C. My take is the controller is straighter but putting and chipping is harder but as long as people are happy playing that is all that matters. It's a game folks and it's about having fun and being comfortable playing it and whatever you use to achieve that Is good. On the competitive side in order to achieve parity you will have to separate the swings in the future but for now it is what it is and I myself am looking forward to tomorrow when Augusta comes out so I can get my arse handed to me but I will be smiling the whole time.

[mebby]

Using the Speedlink XEOX Pro myself and it's pretty much like the F310 and I am hitting about 75% of the greens and fairways and still struggle to keep it at par and never problem with that using MS or 3C. My take is the controller is straighter but putting and chipping is harder but as long as people are happy playing that is all that matters. It's a game folks and it's about having fun and being comfortable playing it and whatever you use to achieve that Is good. On the competitive side in order to achieve parity you will have to separate the swings in the future but for now it is what it is and I myself am looking forward to tomorrow when Augusta comes out so I can get my arse handed to me but I will be smiling the whole time.

Well said. I agree.

[DivotMaker]

Well said. I agree.

Ditto.