906 replies to this topic

[Buck]

I finally got an official reply to this tonight from Producer Shaun West:

 

"Users will have direct connection to each other and will see seamless gameplay depending on latency. You can catch a small glimpse of this in the announcement trailer as well where the shots are happening one to one. We will be testing this under various circumstances to provide the best MP experience we can at release."

 

His description meets my definition of real time, provided it performs as advertised.  

 

JC - would you be so kind as to link to the trailer he mentioned?

Thx

 

Edit : Found it:

[JCat04]

JC - would you be so kind as to link to the trailer he mentioned?

Thx

 

Edit : Found it:

 

Glad you brought this up... I looked at that video again after reading a reply a few posts after Shaun's, which alerts the viewer to look at 1:28 into the video, where you can see the guy that Shaun is playing against, just to the right and about 6 feet further away.  Shaun's animation on his co-workers screen seems to be at worst 20 ms behind what Shaun is doing.  I don't know how accurately their test environment mimics an internet connection though. 

[zmax - sim]

Sure looks like real time multiplayer.   Great for TGC players.

[Acrilix]

If the multiplayer is good and their network code creates smooth gameplay HB might just win me and my brother back with this one. We're getting very tired of all the stutters, pauses and slides we're currently getting on JNPG. As much as we love JNPG far more than TGC, the times we can play now without issues are getting more and more infrequent. We are even talking about giving Links 2003 another try!

[Buck]

If the multiplayer is good and their network code creates smooth gameplay HB might just win me and my brother back with this one.!

Yep!
There is fruit to be picked from Trackman Tree...especially since we aren't sure anyone here is tending the garden much at this point.

[Ted_Ball]

Why would Trackman sink time and money into PG2 to compete against TGC3 for PC considering the less than satisfactory sales of PG1?

 

I think it's dead Jim. 

[Buck]

Why would Trackman sink time and money into PG2 to compete against TGC3 for PC considering the less than satisfactory sales of PG1?

 

I think it's dead Jim. 

 

Sorry for being less than clear...

I meant we here in the PG world are the "fruit" on Trackman Tree and are ripe to be picked off by HB w/ TGC 2019...assuming they can fix a few of the major nags from the previous versions.

[Ted_Ball]

I am also sorry for being less than clear. 

 

Yes I agree we are fruit to be swept along to TGC3 which is why Trackman might not bother competing for the PC market. 

 

You have to admire HB Studios for continued development and willingness to improve with innovations and to put past blunders behind them - unlike PG1 which is barely out of an Early Access standard.

[gravedodger]

The hottest topic on PP forums is one about TGC2 ...

 

The internets are a funny old place sometimes   

[shimonko]

Why would Trackman sink time and money into PG2 to compete against TGC3 for PC considering the less than satisfactory sales of PG1?

I think it's dead Jim. 

 

Trackman/PG will be competing against E6 Connect and FSX2018 - I highly doubt TGC appears on their radar to excuse the pun.  They would consider TGC more in the Winning Putt, WGT, EA basket, even though IMO it seems better than FSX..

[✠ davef ✠]

i see Anthony in here reading this thread,

you folks over there need a 3C method of swing

[AnthonyKyne]

i see Anthony in here reading this thread,

you folks over there need a 3C method of swing

I don't work on TGC anymore - I left HB over a year ago.

I'm against 3-click for one reason. When we set out to make the game, it was all about trying to emulate that need for a deft touch and nuance around the green. I loved we achieved that with the putting. 3-click, although I'm a massive fan in other games, doesn't fit the bill for that. Saying that HB might decide they want it in the next version, as it's nothing to do with me anymore

[gravedodger]

Nothing wrong with wanting to develop the game around a 'deft touch and nuance' but at the risk of turning customers away in a game genre that is already smaller than most is maybe not be greatest marketing approach.

I bypassed TGC1 for that reason and only bought TGC2 in the sale to test it and curiosity, rest assured, had TGC had 3 Click option I would've bought it upon release, no questions asked.

If it's a multiplayer player skill / difficulty thing then just lock the control methods when joining a multiplyer game, it's a simple solution.

Choice ... the gamer's pleasure
 

[RobV]

Curious Anthony... what are you up to now?   Coming here to work on PG2?  

[AnthonyKyne]

Nothing wrong with wanting to develop the game around a 'deft touch and nuance' but at the risk of turning customers away in a game genre that is already smaller than most is maybe not be greatest marketing approach.

I bypassed TGC1 for that reason and only bought TGC2 in the sale to test it and curiosity, rest assured, had TGC had 3 Click option I would've bought it upon release, no questions asked.

If it's a multiplayer player skill / difficulty thing then just lock the control methods when joining a multiplyer game, it's a simple solution.

Choice ... the gamer's pleasure
 

Yeah and that's always a good argument for doing it. Mine is though, that if The Beatles management said we're not appealing to all these Jazz fans with your brand of music put a couple of Jazz songs on and we'll get all them as well - would Sgt Peppers be as good with a couple of Jazz tracks on?

I'm not comparing TGC with Sgt Peppers but when doing something like this you have to do what you do well, it's why restaurants with small menus normally have a Michelin star. If you try to please everyone you'll end up pleasing no one. So I felt it was better to stick to our guns on what we wanted and to not just try and chase the dollar - because in the long run we'd have a better chance of beating the competition.

It's also the same with difficulty levels - I saw so many reviews of PGA saying it was too easy, but if you ask Divot, dependant on what settings you had it wasn't. So instead of trying to tune multiple set-ups to make everything be amazing. You're better off having one mode of play and tuning that well.

Choice always sounds great, but it's only great if all the options lead to a great experience. If not - you're getting very varied feedback, review scores, etc and no one is really getting the experience they want

[AnthonyKyne]

Curious Anthony... what are you up to now?   Coming here to work on PG2?  

I've just started as Exec Producer at Team6 Games - we're just finishing up this project. http://www.superstreet-thegame.com/

I haven't had a chance to get my teeth into anything major yet though, so I can't claim any of this as my work.

I left HB to work for a company in London doing all the VR experiences for Jaguar, but it was way to corporate for my liking so left that after a year. I don't think I could join a rival golf game, it would be like playing for Arsenal after you've played for Tottenham

[gravedodger]

It's an okay argument for multiplayer mode ... but not for single player, we'll agree to disagree.

The Beatles / Jazz  music comparison would only be relevant if TGC was trying to be a different genre of game not just a control method, think about it, the Beatles still used the same instruments as used in Jazz groups   

[RobV]

I've just started as Exec Producer at Team6 Games - we're just finishing up this project. http://www.superstreet-thegame.com/

I haven't had a chance to get my teeth into anything major yet though, so I can't claim any of this as my work.

I left HB to work for a company in London doing all the VR experiences for Jaguar, but it was way to corporate for my liking so left that after a year. I don't think I could join a rival golf game, it would be like playing for Arsenal after you've played for Tottenham

Well, good luck you Anthony... hope it all works out well for you no matter what you. 

I will also check out Super Street... was a big Dirt fan, but not generally a car racing fan.   there are many that do like racing games here though.. 

[JCat04]

The hottest topic on PP forums is one about TGC2 ...

 

The internets are a funny old place sometimes 

 

Turn about is fair play, the hottest topic on TGC's Forum is one about Perfect Golf... it has almost 686,000 page views!  One of the devs stopped in the thread to congratulate those who frequent the thread on getting it to the 500,000 mark, which I thought was pretty cool.  Those guys have a really good sense of humor, as Anthony is showing evidence of in this thread  , and you're starting to see more of that now that the shackles of Maximum Games has been taken from them.

 

Anthony, it must have been difficult to leave Lunenburg.  I found the two flyover shots of Lunenburg at the start of the TGC 2019 preview video stunning yesterday.  Even my wife remarked about how beautiful it was.  

[AnthonyKyne]

It's an okay argument for multiplayer mode ... but not for single player, we'll agree to disagree.

The Beatles / Jazz  music comparison would only be relevant if TGC was trying to be a different genre of game not just a control method, think about it, the Beatles still used the same instruments as used in Jazz groups 

I don't think I explained it well enough - even for the single player experience we want to make sure it's a tailored experience. For reviewers and first time players. The more options you have, the more people can deviate from the well tuned path. That means a lot of first experiences can then be bad, lead to poor reviews both professional and public on steam. And even for the experienced player -the more options to tailor how you play, although would be massively beneficial if they all worked. End up un-tuned and lead to a poor experience. When you're a relatively small team with time budgets, you have to make sure you balance everything you give to the players is a good experience.

I was always accused by people of not liking options - that's not true, I love options. The course designer being the greatest option ever. But even that with the option to control green speeds creates poor playing experiences. So you need to make sure that every option that goes in, is balanced well and people know explicitly it's an option. And modern gamers aren't willing to look around, they pick up for 5 minutes, they make their mind up and if you're lucky they don't ask for a refund which ends up costing you money.

With regards 3-click,it's again like to difficulty stuff, trying to balance it so it's equal for everyone is near impossible and it took away from one of the major parts of the game - the nuance of the short game. And to risk that at a relatively small percentage of the market, I didn't feel was worth it.

At the end of the day, when you're not a Take 2 or Ubisoft you can't do everything. So you have to do what you think will give you the best game for the time and resource available. Hoping with each game you do well enough, to improve on that again.