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#261 sirputterman

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Posted 04 June 2015 - 04:29 AM

axe360, on 03 Jun 2015 - 8:00 PM, said:

Yep, here it is.. Reverse view.. I'm not sure if I would like it back just a little more.. I digress..

 

picture004.jpg

I agree Axe it probably should be back further to give a better view. Glad they finally included the 4 key but man if they could add the FSWD  keys it would even be better. They could leave the 4 key as is then by using the S key it would pan backwards from there to wherever you wanted. Use the F key to go up or the V key to get a more ground level view or W to go forwards

Like or hate TW the short cut keys for camera views were and I think still are the best in any Golf game period. The Ability to even customize the cameras move rate was also a great feature.

Hopefully these are still to come as honestly they do add to the enhancement of the game very much more then some would think. They can also speed up play if you are not spending time  trying to figure out  the landing area or  the  pin locations  (that could be addressed simply by clicking on the overhead and getting a camera view of  where ever you moved the mouse. ) I know it sounds like a lot but seriously if it was in a game since the Tw 05 version at least then I'm pretty confident these guys could implement it without a big time or resource strain. Of course I'm not a programmer but if it has been done in the past it's probably not that hard to duplicate it.  

Like  I say though it does show promise to see the 4 key finally added and I really do appreciate its implementation by PP 


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#262 Guest_deena_golf_*

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Posted 04 June 2015 - 07:08 AM

Yeah - they'll be on to it alright, they know they know don't panic  :D  

 

but equally - yes, it's like the first deep breath in to stage 2 of this EA journey - chapter 1 was just dandy wasn't it! definately makes me want to read on further....



#263 Armand

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Posted 04 June 2015 - 12:31 PM

Sinewiz, on 01 Jun 2015 - 3:37 PM, said:

Completely agree. It's nothing more than a legal cheat. In real life it would be almost impossible to pull off a shot like that as opposed to it being a simple shot to get close rather than a probable 3 putt. Allowed shot in real life or not,do away with it. ;)

Chipping should be allowed, but it should be more difficult than putting - which is why I think you don't see the pros do it very often.  If the putting sensitivity can be altered, I'm guessing the chipping sensitivity can also be altered when you are on the green (or even a tightly-mowed area near the green).  Then, the chipping could be more difficult than putting from such surfaces and players would more often choose to putt.



#264 PurpleTurf

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 12:58 AM

Armand, on 04 Jun 2015 - 12:31 PM, said:

Chipping should be allowed, but it should be more difficult than putting - which is why I think you don't see the pros do it very often.  If the putting sensitivity can be altered, I'm guessing the chipping sensitivity can also be altered when you are on the green (or even a tightly-mowed area near the green).  Then, the chipping could be more difficult than putting from such surfaces and players would more often choose to putt.

Play No Aids.  Chipping is super sensative and more realistic.  And short chips really hard to hit perfect snap, which you need or its 5 feet wide and wrong distance.



#265 Griz891

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 02:54 AM

axe360, on 03 Jun 2015 - 8:00 PM, said:

Yep, here it is.. Reverse view.. I'm not sure if I would like it back just a little more.. I digress..

 

picture004.jpg

Seems to close to the hole to me...could be back a little bit more, but I like the idea of having a reverse cam for putting.


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#266 Kablammo11

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 08:15 AM

Thanks for dragging me into this, guys.

 

Gimcrack, on 03 Jun 2015 - 8:52 PM, said:

Thank you axe360. I'm not sure I like the look of that, but maybe there is some more work to do on it. Is the design supposed to be 'cartoony'?

 

The design is clumsy, because I am a clumsy 3D mesh designer with limited tools and very finite skills. Eagerly awaiting your own, much more skilfully executed clubhouse designs. 

Design also happens to be an iterative process. Find the latest version below.

 

 

Dazmaniac, on 03 Jun 2015 - 9:07 PM, said:

The green texture you see is K11's base Unity texture which is overlaid on to his terrain height-map, which helps him draw out the holes in Course Forge. The pic above does not yet have CF splines/textures applied out for the hole/green you can see. As for the clubhouse, that comes from the depths of K11's mind, lol.

 

Here's a pic where he has applied CF splines/textures which now cover what you saw above and he has also reworked the clubhouse.

 

i6vTmy9.jpg

 

 

Buck, on 03 Jun 2015 - 9:18 PM, said:

hmmm...

 

 

Even if just focusing on the water, I'm not really impressed. 

Makes me think of a demo for a Wii version of Wave Race or something

 

Correct, the reflective pro water is a lot better, but not perfect, even though the image above shows it from an angle you will never get to see it in the game and there will be wave movement in the finished product. Despite all its shortcomings and its questionable status of being the best part of a limited choice proposed by the free version of Unity 5 - and in the spirit of pragmatism - I must remark that this water "it is what it is", also happens to be "as good as it gets" and that "that is that". 

For a vastly superior sensation of immersion, perhaps you might want to go an jump into a real pond? jk - that turn of phrase somehow offered itself at this juncture.

 

BAv8Ko3.jpg


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#267 Guest_deena_golf_*

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 08:32 AM

all that talk of water and immersion by the ever-dry Kablammo :lol:



#268 Buck

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 02:37 PM

I really like the water the way it is in the game now.

Hopefully they'll be some "totally glassy" water at some point and some course designs where special texture detail work gets done around where the water and land meet up



#269 axe360

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 02:43 PM

Buck, on 06 Jun 2015 - 2:37 PM, said:

I really like the water the way it is in the game now.

Hopefully they'll be some "totally glassy" water at some point and some course designs where special texture detail work gets done around where the water and land meet up

 

Yep, the special design work will be bushes... They are are friends... lol


Done with designing.

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The Golf Club @ Dove Mnt. AZ

Aronimink PA

Amana Colonies Iowa

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#270 tlvx

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 06:56 PM

The putting meter - without any distance markers - is frankly going to be too difficult for all but those that employ the most detailed of charts.

 

This, in my opinion, takes away the *feel* of putting, and renders it an exercise in simply beating the game at its intended difficulty.

 

What it does is forces a user to consider implementing their own overlay, with distance markers... kind of like users did with TW08 for the PC. There were all sorts of overlays available to make the gameplay easier. But, as far as I know, there's nothing to prevent that sort of thing from taking away the fairness in a game.

 

Even if it's just sticking some translucent tape with guidelines directly onto one's screen... the game shouldn't compel serious players to do such things.

 

Better to just give all users the option, as a maximum aid, to have 10% increments marked on the meter - without the flag - so, that the users still have to at least determine the adjusted distance on their own... but, instead of just guessing during & throughout execution.

 

Users that do not want an incremental meter can simply set games with the aids off.

 

Better to have inclusive options... rather than exclusive ones.

 

As an aside, games without aids should be a setting that is controlled by the host, for all players involved. For fair play, a grouping must have all players playing on the same level of difficulty... unless we're talking handicaps. But, I'll leave that for another discussion.


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#271 Buck

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 06:58 PM

I agree with TLVX

 

At the no aids level I can understand absolutely no markings whatsoever on the putting meter… But I would really appreciate seeing some dots just for reference at the other aid levels. 

 

It really isn't making it much easier, just more pleasurable, as you still have to judge for the up and down etc



#272 Rehit

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 08:17 PM

i like the lack of distance reference points.

it took me about 15 minutes practicing to find the (relative) max distance on the putting meter.

that gives me an idea what the distance is for putts by using the meter like hands on a clock.

a little more practice and putting is manageable and will get even better the more i (practice) play.
that is how real golf works and now so does our new putting.


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#273 Buck

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 08:20 PM

Rehit, on 06 Jun 2015 - 8:17 PM, said:

i like the lack of distance reference points...

...that is how real golf works and now so does our new putting.

 

I guess I just don't see why a really "max" aid level couldn't have this optionally available (distance ref dots).

 

Isn't that sort of the concept of an "aid"?  

(something to give extra help for those who need/want it)

 

I'm a Min/Min guy myself, but love for everyone to have options to play how they prefer



#274 tlvx

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 09:10 PM

Rehit, on 06 Jun 2015 - 8:17 PM, said:

i like the lack of distance reference points.

it took me about 15 minutes practicing to find the (relative) max distance on the putting meter.

that gives me an idea what the distance is for putts by using the meter like hands on a clock.

a little more practice and putting is manageable and will get even better the more i (practice) play.
that is how real golf works and now so does our new putting.

 

You miss the point of my post.

 

While it may seem like a realistic challenge to you... someone else will just make an app that gives them precise control over their putts... while everyone else hobbles along... guesstimating.

 

Making things more undefined really just makes it easier for the top one percent of players to - define it, with exclusivity - and stay one step ahead of everyone else.

 

The meter should not be so imprecise, to the point where the ideas that I've put forth would be such an advantage over the field.

 

Taking it one step further... if there was no visual meter at all... that would just make the geeks rejoice, as there will always be parameters that can be figured out. All it ends up doing is making it so that everyone that is not savvy, remains handicapped, in perpetuity.

 

A game should endeavor to level the playing field... not make it so hard for the average user to learn, that they will never be able to compete with someone that employs charts and such.

 

By the way, currently, I have a spreadsheet containing hundreds of distance points on the meter, with all of the clubs. This is a huge advantage over players that just implicitly trust how far the game tells them that their clubs will travel.

 

But, it is ridiculous that anyone wouldn't be able to just pick up and play the game competitively, if they could execute the swing discipline.

 

Why should it be so challenging to figure out how far to hit a shot? It's not like adding incremental points makes anyone execute better. That's still the name of the game, right... execution.

 

In real life, if the pro golfers could always hit the ball precisely where they were aiming, they would be shooting 59's with regularity. It's not like adding 10% increments on the meter would rear back and hit the shot for anyone.

 

The problem with *intended* difficulty... is that only a few of us will have done the research - with all the contrived physics given - to figure out how far each club travels, at different levels of power... which varies wildly between the fairway and the green... a bit unrealistically, in my opinion.

 

The point is, that the distance given on the bottom right hand of the screen, is not instructive enough to play well... without employing detailed distance charts.

 

Figuring out how far to hit a shot should not be so imprecise, that an average player cannot even figure out what they are doing wrong.

 

In a perfect world, I'd always agree with the most challenging approach. But, in PC land... these types of things just make the top 1 percent of players... far better than everyone else.



#275 Greensboronclion

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 09:29 PM

My take on this is that once you start practicing with the new meter you will at some point start figuring it out to the point it will work. Dots are not that big of a deal and the goal is to make the putting feel real and it should be the hardest part of the game. Thru the years in real golf the putter has killed me and I once in my youth carried a 2 handicap and if I could putt today with any consistency I would be close to that number again instead of being the 8 to 10 I am. Tom Watson was the best ball striker in the world between 1983 till 1999 and dint win till 1999 due to the fact he couldn't make a 3 ft putt so it's the most important part of the game. Dots only make it easier and that shouldn't be the goal. Just my two cents.

#276 Richard

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 09:42 PM

I don't understand this whole discussion regarding swing meter markings, whether the regular or the putting meter. One would still have to determine and memorize or chart the distances for any of the markings. I don't need a mark to know where 9:00, 9:30 or 10:00 is and to figure out what that distance is a flat green. Additionally since the greens are never flat, what good does it do to figure out a 20 ft. putting mark when the 20 ft. putt has an elevation change of +- 12 inches. Without practice, I still won't know what mark to use for that type of putt. I don't really see how markings can really aid someone. It will still take practice to be a successful putter. Just my 2¢.


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#277 Buck

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 09:57 PM

Richard, on 06 Jun 2015 - 9:42 PM, said:

I don't understand this whole discussion regarding swing meter markings, whether the regular or the putting meter. One would still have to determine and memorize or chart the distances for any of the markings. I don't need a mark to know where 9:00, 9:30 or 10:00 is and to figure out what that distance is a flat green. Additionally since the greens are never flat, what good does it do to figure out a 20 ft. putting mark when the 20 ft. putt has an elevation change of +- 12 inches. Without practice, I still won't know what mark to use for that type of putt. I don't really see how markings can really aid someone. It will still take practice to be a successful putter. Just my 2¢.

 

It's a fair point, especially since the meter is linear (not always the case in golf games over the years)

 

Just sounded like some people found it helpful to have reference points to orient themselves during the process of swinging and I'm a big "give people options" guy is all.

 

As with all options - If it helps some people and doesn't impact those who choose not to use it...What's the harm?



#278 Richard

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 10:09 PM

Buck, on 06 Jun 2015 - 9:57 PM, said:

It's a fair point, especially since the meter is linear (not always the case in golf games over the years)

 

Just sounded like some people found it helpful to have reference points to orient themselves during the process of swinging and I'm a big "give people options" guy is all.

 

As with all options - If it helps some people and doesn't impact those who choose not to use it...What's the harm?

 

I just don't see it as being an aid at all as I indicated in my post above. However, if it does materialize it should be unavailable as an option for all difficulty settings with the exception of Max/Max.


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#279 tlvx

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 10:10 PM

The problem with our collective thinking... is that we are assuming - with more than a bit of naivety - that our opponents will be playing without distance markers... just because they are not available to us.

 

There has to be more consideration for fair-play... in real terms, and not just ideologically. The world doesn't work that way.

 

In real life... a player knows if they've hit a good putt, almost as soon as it leaves the club face. Most good putters of the ball, look up to the pin, several times, just before hitting a putt, to determine their bearings.

 

Without any distance or power indication on the meter... there is nothing defined - other than the eventuality of the result - that will tell a player that they have hit the ball too hard, or too soft.

 

Think of it this way. The snap line is there, with good reason. It doesn't need to be there, because we all know where 180 degrees is. But, imagine for a second, how much more you would actually miss, if there were no visual snap indicator?

 

Not having a specific goal to hit, completely affects our ability to actively track the timing of the discipline.

 

So, now apply the same logic to power. We all know where 180, 270, & 360 degrees are, respectively. But, without any indication during a moving meter... one slightly loses their bearings, so to speak, when attempting to set precise power.

 

It may seem like a good way to make things less precise. But, it is really just a way to alienate the good majority of players, from ever even gaining the requisite comprehension, in an effort to be competitive.

 

Charting the distance, without markings... is actually quite difficult. It took me several hours straight, over the course of a few days, to chart enough points on the meter, to feel like – if I could execute – I had at least a modicum of control over my game. --And, I'm still not done... as there is always the odd 70 foot or 70 yard shot from completely uninhabited parts of the course... that will give my dutiful charts much pause.

 

And, even still... with perfect execution, I'm plus or minus approximately 2% on the meter... which can be significant, considering putting is a discipline in which the speed and the line are not mutually exclusive. A 4% power adjustment is the difference between hitting it through the break, and hitting the center of the cup... and people, this is not random research I'm talking about.

 

It will be far too toilsome, for most players to ever feel like they have any control over the outcome of a good shot.

 

Consider, even if all of the putt distances were charted... without the aid of distance or power increments... one will never know if they've actually hit a good putt, unless the correct power measurement - for that particular putt - happens to be at 270, or 360 degrees on the meter.

 

Everything else is just guesstimating, both during and after the swing.

 

Hard to improve at a game, when you don't even know where you've gone wrong, between aim and execution.

 

But again, it just goes back to what I've been saying the whole time... you're just making it difficult for 99% of the players; and, simultaneously creating an insulatory platform for certain savvy users to have undue success - in spite of everyone else's *intended* level of difficulty.


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#280 Ted_Ball

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Posted 06 June 2015 - 10:10 PM

I've been waiting for this topic. Do you think I should put this on Kickstarter?

 

FzE2d1w.png

 

Vive le drapeau à distance






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