373 replies to this topic

[Arsam]

Sirputterman, if you would review the last several pages of this thread and then re read my comment you should see that at no time did I state or infer that PG should be a updated clone of Links 2003 or TW for that matter. I think that you will see that the discussion at hand is wether there shoul be graduated marks on the swing meter to indicate backstroke for a given putt distance.
The point that I was trying to make is that when we were learning to play golf IRL there was no markings on the green to indicate how far of a backstroke you needed to make the putt. You learned by making many putts and getting a feel for how hard to hit the ball for a given distance. Shouldn't a good golf simulator recreate this same learning experience?

[Buck]

@Richard:

Did something change with the flight of the ball and that camera view?   (the initial drive)

 

For some reason in that shot it seems like the ball is on rails?

[Buck]

Arsam, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:05 PM, said:

Shouldn't a good golf simulator recreate this same learning experience?

 

I think the debate is whether there should be varying levels of aids and assistance for putting, as there are for other areas of the swing already.

 

People arguing "no" - I don't really understand how it would impact anyone choosing not to use higher (more) aid levels.  

 

As sirputter has nicely stated, it could be of great assistance to those who would like to "wade into the game" (rather than dive in) or perhaps some people simply like a more casual game.

 

This conversation doesn't even impact me as I enjoy Min/Min (Hopefully I will enjoy the putting too now - haha) - But I *totally* understand the argument for having some optional ways to play that make the game more accessible.

 

The last thing you want is to make a game that has no options other than "golf is tough - learn to deal with it".  It's a game - Has to be fun for them and how they like to play (or are capable of playing) or people will simply dump it.

[Richard]

Buck, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:09 PM, said:

@Richard:

Did something change with the flight of the ball and that camera view?   (the initial drive)

 

For some reason in that shot it seems like the ball is on rails?

 

Buck, not sure what you are referring to. I don't understand the 'on rails' comment. The tee shot looks perfectly normal to me.

[Buck]

@Axe:  Good to hear Axe

That tee shot *definitely* looks different than the current generally available game build

[axe360]

Sorry Buck, that earlier comment disappeared, as I was saying, many of us don't like the Follow Cam view and the Dev's agreed and are currently working on it..

[Buck]

axe360, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:22 PM, said:

Sorry Buck, that earlier comment disappeared, as I was saying, many of us don't like the Follow Cam view and the Dev's agreed and are currently working on it..

 

I'm guessing the change to that was an attempt to remedy the slightly "bouncy" camera when the ball is making contact with the ground?

[axe360]

Yes,  but sometimes when you try to fix one thing, you end up with other things going awry. They had the bounce taken out but the view was not good among other things. So they are reworking it.. 

[Buck]

axe360, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:36 PM, said:

Yes,  but sometimes when you try to fix one thing, you end up with other things going awry. They had the bounce taken out but the view was not good among other things. So they are reworking it.. 

 

Frustrating for them I'm sure. I appreciate that they are working to fix it though. 

I abandoned the follow cam awhile back until that bouncy thing got some love. 

[axe360]

Now here we go... Look Ma. No aids,  no cheesy flag markers, no dots, no hashes, no slashes.. Just feel. I am already starting to get a handle on the feel of the new putting... I still have a long way's to go (which is gr8) but I'm really liking it.. So again, all, just try it first, then comment on it.. This is a 13ft putt with a 4inch drop...

 

[axe360]

Let me say this.. I have no problems with a flag or dots or whatever the devs come up with, on the putting meter as long as when you play with No aids, it is not there.. Or maybe it can be on only Maximum aids?  I just wish everyone would wait until they try the new putting meter, before they start clamoring for something different..

As we all know there are already aids in putting and everything else, so it's not like you aren't getting any help but I think most would like this for distance control.. But and it is PG's game, having markers on the meter aren't like IRL.. But I'm sure if enough want something at the more novice levles, they would have an open mind.. Not that I speak for them though, its just my opinion having worked with them for almost 2 yrs now..

 

Mike and Andrew and Rehit and all the devs, listen very closely to the community and if enough of the community/ after first trying this, still want an added marker for at least the max aid level then I'm quite sure they would be willing to listen.. So give it a try first, then let's see.

Of course, I am just one person and it takes more then just me to make changes...

[sirputterman]

Arsam, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:05 PM, said:

Sirputterman, if you would review the last several pages of this thread and then re read my comment you should see that at no time did I state or infer that PG should be a updated clone of Links 2003 or TW for that matter. I think that you will see that the discussion at hand is wether there shoul be graduated marks on the swing meter to indicate backstroke for a given putt distance.
The point that I was trying to make is that when we were learning to play golf IRL there was no markings on the green to indicate how far of a backstroke you needed to make the putt. You learned by making many putts and getting a feel for how hard to hit the ball for a given distance. Shouldn't a good golf simulator recreate this same learning experience?

Hey I understand the desire of having the choice of it being like a real putt swing but again would the golfing game world come crashing to a screeching halt if on Max aids there were percentage indicators or marks? That I kind of think is the idea of Max aids. Some that have never played a golf game real or pc would have this "aid" to get a better idea of how hard to hit it. Realistically its a visual aid and certainly no guarantee your going to drain 50 footers. You still have to take in consideration green stimp and elevations either up or down and then  guestimate  how much pass or short of a mark you need to hit. It does though give a learning tool though so if you hit it say more then 25 % but less then 35% and it goes either really long or really short you then get an idea for the next time.

Its all good and fine to have a hard core no aids and practice until your eyes bleed from staring at the screen so long setting and that is what no aids is for. I just think to get the fringe players that are casual to playing a round or two a week involved and more importantly to keep them involved the idea of markings on the meter for Max aids may help.  

Hey its PP's game and they can do whatever they see fit but to exclude some of the casual players and not get the most out of their investment to me may not be in their total best interest.  To not welcome the casual player by making the game a bit more  "user friendly" to me this sounds like exclusivity though and  I hope that isn't what this game turns into. Either you play hard core no holds barred or go somewhere else.  I  honestly don't think  that is the intention of PP as it does has Max aids now so why wouldn't this just be added to in that catagory?

[mebby]

Richard, on 07 Jun 2015 - 12:57 PM, said:

TREE FOLIAGE AND BRANCH COLLISION:

 

I thought I'd share the fact that the U5 update will include impact resulting from tree and foliage collisions. My 2nd shot of 260 yards only went about 215 yards as a result:

 

 

Some other things to note:

 

The ball rolls out much more realistic, IMHO.

 

The undulations of the course are much more apparent with the U5 update.

 

The camera is somewhat jittery, but I anticipate that it will be rectified prior to release.

 

Enjoy!!

Ahhhh!  That is so much better!!  The ball seemed to behave as expected going through the foliage and the sounds were reasonably good as well!

[Greensboronclion]

axe360, on 07 Jun 2015 - 1:50 PM, said:

Now here we go... Look Ma. No aids,  no cheesy flag markers, no dots, no hashes, no slashes.. Just feel. I am already starting to get a handle on the feel of the new putting... I still have a long way's to go (which is gr8) but I'm really liking it.. So again, all, just try it first, then comment on it.. This is a 13ft putt with a 4inch drop...
 

Looks sweet to me.

[tlvx]

Those tree collisions are much improved. The sounds are great.

That said, I'm not so sure the likelihood of the ball getting through all of that foliage, when aimed at the fat part of a row of trees, back to back.

It seems like they should turn up the sensitivity for the ball to - at some point - get caught up and drop.

Nevertheless, it's nice to see improvements in progress.

[sirputterman]

deena_golf, on 07 Jun 2015 - 3:23 PM, said:

ooooooh all this nonsense before me - just get a free CAD program and a screen editor - i'll give you the bloody links for those who aren't man enough to take the stabilizers off....

 

it's a mans frontier - get used to it bleeters....

 

3-d grass, nice camera landing, marks on the meter - holiday in marbeya types, see the golf club.

 

emergent physics, cameras for information gathering, meters for discovery - serious golf enthusiasts, PG.

 

stiff upper lip and only mad dogs what...

 

what?

So I gather that you are saying PP should ignore the less then hard core  player and try to make a go of it. Good luck with that. Golf games are not the biggest  draw in gaming at best and you think it would be wise to make the numbers smaller by excluding the less then fanatical  players? 

The reality is I would think for PP is to eventually make some money off the game another reality is to only cater to the hard core sim player would probably kill it faster then you can blink.  As I said PP has max aids options all ready so why not include meter markings in max aids? This doesn't stop you or me  or Raplh from  not using them but it does allow those that are not  rabid golf gamers to have a more enjoyable experience .  Not rocket science really. More options  better chance of  getting more players = more money. Less options  possibiltity of  turning people away from the game = less money. 

Hey I suppose they could go hard core and charge 500 for the game so those that really really really like the game can pay for it but   probably that wouldn't help either because all of a sudden most of those hard core sim players would say no thanks I would rather have a roof over my head.         

[sirputterman]

Oh and the whole thing about better camera views to be able to see the landing area and 3 d grass. Well that to me is more like reality. 95% of the time you have a good view of where you are trying to hit the ball with the occasional blind tee shot. And the last time I was out on the course and whacked it in the guack I could see how tall and thick the grass was. What we have right now isn't reality. Hopefully some day these will be included to give the hardcore sim playing experience. 

[Buck]

tlvx, on 07 Jun 2015 - 3:56 PM, said:

I'm not so sure the likelihood of the ball getting through all of that foliage

It seems like they should turn up the sensitivity for the ball to - at some point - get caught up and drop.

 

+1 - Maybe just a fluke, but it did seem like a *lot* of trees to get through relatively unaffected.