168 replies to this topic

[maxie]

3-click only (tour pro) tour please!! I almost never see unrealistic scoring or stats with tour pro 3-click players.

olympic fun tournament  euro tour  davser -41  josh-36 tour pro 3 click

[Sliceapottomus]

Well then I guess I should be Really Upset at the guy that showed Me how to learn to hit it straight using windows paint program....

 

logitec m100

Designed ergonomically, the Logitech Corded Mouse M100 lets you work comfortably at your computer. With its ambidextrous design, the Logitech optical mouse can be used by both right- and left-handed users. The simple design of this product makes it easy to use. Setting up this mouse is straightforward. Simply plug it into the USB port of your computer. The Logitech wired optical mouse features high-definition optical tracking that provides accurate control and makes object selection a breeze. This USB mouse also offers side-to-side scrolling that makes navigation between spreadsheets and scrolling through documents effortless. The multi-function scroll wheel makes this USB corded mouse more convenient to use. The black color of this product allows it to match most modern keyboards.

please let me know which mice are allowed before i by my next one

I have seen 2 reports on the model 1 that says its 720 dpi and 1 that says its 1000 so who knows..

[Bahnzo]

Wow, what a can of worms they opened with this anti-cheat, eh?

 

For mouse swing: it's not so much a problem of a straight swing plane. This is achievable with a good amount of practice. It's more about the mishit (heel/toe). If one gets a 0 mishit regularly it's fishy because with a sensitive mouse this is very hard to do regularly. There should be the main focus of the anti-cheat.

I have read in another thread that the RTS-C doesn't even have mishit at all. Is that right? At least it is a source of penalty the controller users don't have to worry about.

 

Frank has this right. I have a pretty sensitive mouse that has no way to adjust dpi settings that I've found, and all you need to do is go into the driving range and watch the details posted after the swing. It's downright impossible to have a swing which is the same time after time. If they are, then something fishy is going on. I'm fairly sure that's how the anti-cheat was working, at least as far as the mouse was concerned. It's just too much of a coincidence to have a mouse swing hitting zero plane and zero heel/toe, even once....when it happens more than once, then the cheat kicked in. 

 

That said, I have a wired Xbox 360 controller sitting around that I haven't used in some time. So I plugged it in and gave it some time in the game playing RTS-C....it's night and day. The controller is WAY easier than the mouse. With the mouse, I struggle with hacker to be somewhat consistent. With the controller, I could play pro right away, and maybe tour pro with some practice. It's no contest. And yet, it was still nearly impossible to hit the exact same shot (numbers wise at the driving range) time after time. 

 

So....I'm all for the cheat detection. But, I'm all for it only when it comes to online like OGT, and it should be an option for online play in the lobby. For all I care, what someone does on their own time, as long as it doesn't effect me, is no skin off my nose. But if you take it online, then we need something to even the playing field. And that includes people who really aren't cheating, but just have a mouse that is either just so insensitive that it's easy to hit straight, or that has it's sensitivity turned down. I don't know what the answer there is...telling someone you have to buy a better mouse isn't right, but either is it giving them a solid edge on others because of it. 

 

I'm all for OGT if they want to make rules about what controller/mouse you can use. It's their site, they can do with it as they want. Maybe make the official tourneys that way and have other's that are more open for the others?

[JTee1]

I was

 

Well then I guess I should be Really Upset at the guy that showed Me how to learn to hit it straight using windows paint program....

 

logitec m100

Designed ergonomically, the Logitech Corded Mouse M100 lets you work comfortably at your computer. With its ambidextrous design, the Logitech optical mouse can be used by both right- and left-handed users. The simple design of this product makes it easy to use. Setting up this mouse is straightforward. Simply plug it into the USB port of your computer. The Logitech wired optical mouse features high-definition optical tracking that provides accurate control and makes object selection a breeze. This USB mouse also offers side-to-side scrolling that makes navigation between spreadsheets and scrolling through documents effortless. The multi-function scroll wheel makes this USB corded mouse more convenient to use. The black color of this product allows it to match most modern keyboards.

please let me know which mice are allowed before i by my next one

I have seen 2 reports on the model 1 that says its 720 dpi and 1 that says its 1000 so who knows..

I personally don't expect or want anyone to go out and buy a mouse on my part. Simply info for those to understand why the anti cheat was affecting some players and  not others.   I was asked to post my findings so I did. Then I respond to posts the best i can. I was content before, during and after the anti cheat came about. Anti cheat didn't kick in or alter my game play. I still hit very str8 but not perfect. For those it did affect I had nothing to do with implementing of it.  I was away on vacation, just got back at the wrong time i guess. LOL

I did add a list of mice with good sensors and no prediction or acceleration. Obviously any mouse on the list that you can deaden the x axis separately would have a tremendous advantage.  Tip: Save the package so you can return it, just in case it don't work out.

 

To check DPI: http://www.mouse-sen...pianalyzer.html

[Bahnzo]

Obviously any mouse on the list that you can deaden the x axis separately would have a tremendous advantage.  

 

Since we have both RTSM and RTSH (with H  being horizontal) I would guess being able to deaden any axis would provide the advantage, not just the x. 

[Sliceapottomus]

exacyly my point what is one to think when one buys an optical mouse that is suposed to be realy good much better and reliable than laser mice... still dont see what is wrong with this mouse I have no software to deaden anything....

 

High-Definition Optical Tracking

You can't go wrong with precise optical tracking. It's a smooth mover — with or without a mouse pad. You'll enjoy responsive, smooth cursor control and precise tracking and easy text selection thanks to high-definition optical tracking (1000dpi).

[Sliceapottomus]

yah.. ok just ran your dpi anylyzer says 1400 and what doe this have to do with the price of tea in china

[JTee1]

 

exacyly my point what is one to think when one buys an optical mouse that is suposed to be realy good much better and reliable than laser mice... still dont see what is wrong with this mouse I have no software to deaden anything....

 

High-Definition Optical Tracking

You can't go wrong with precise optical tracking. It's a smooth mover — with or without a mouse pad. You'll enjoy responsive, smooth cursor control and precise tracking and easy text selection thanks to high-definition optical tracking (1000dpi).

 

Tim I hope this clears things up. My HP mouse is the mouse I tested and the anti cheat made it unplayable. That's all, everyone has to make their own decision on what they do. I've said please don't anyone buy one on my findings. The Anti cheat feature is a mute point at present. I know i never asked you to buy one, so whoever asked you to may have the answer.

[JTee1]

Disclaimer: I havn't been an admin at OGT for a while. Good group of guys but I've been traveling quite a bit lately and couldn't fulfill my duties. Thanks to all the admins there, they try their hardest  to make it enjoyable for us.

Thanks Guys

[JTee1]

Since we have both RTSM and RTSH (with H  being horizontal) I would guess being able to deaden any axis would provide the advantage, not just the x. 

Correct

[Steve2golf]

I looked, I played, I tested. Been at this for years now and Zero axis both back and forward with RTMS and RTC is impossible free hand.

 

Golf both real and fake to be played well is about how well you miss. The goal should never be about the perfect swing straight plane, but the perfect crooked swing plane. Managing misses and controlling a crooked swing is always the goal, at least it should be. Its about honing in on a perfect little draw or a perfect little fade and grooving a repeatable swing. Its starts with what is the players most consistent miss and improving from there.

 

Therein lies the answer IMHO.

 

If we can ever agree that Zero axis, zero offset, zero deviation from swing path both back and forward is impossible free hand without something being faulty. The faulty thing can be quite legit, either the way the game reads and reports the controller, or the controller itself.

 

Zero should result in a shot into the weeds. I watched another game with great interest as the better players swings progressed and went from mostly crooked to varying degrees to mostly dead completely straight. Was this practice, was this do whatever was necessary, who knows don't really care that much. But if the game rewards perfect with perfect, the players will find a way to hit perfect. Thats pretty simple simple.

 

This game should not reward the perfect straight swing path, but call it what it really is, something not at all perfect.

 

Anti-cheat 1.0 in my testing was close, I gave my feedback, only thing I thought that needed improvement was it should of ballooned from the first hit not the 4th consecutive. However that said, if the game is having difficulty picking up on the actual path of the various controllers be it mouse or controller and is giving a false positive so to speak then focus need go there first. But I think the game does pickup fine the actual path of the various controllers quite fine, otherwise the game would be unplayable. It's what the anti-cheat was looking for is the problem IMHO. Its looking for things that likely only exist as a figment or outdated figment of someones imagination as to how things are happening. However I digressed.

 

Anti-cheat 3.0, should not nor need be a complicated mess of technology with a bundle of resources applied to it, but simply pick up any zero deviation over both directions of travel and fire the shot into the weeds.

 

If were talking about cheating, or anti-cheating, you look first to what the cheaters are trying to accomplish first, and that IMHO is zero deviation. This game, almost every golf game rewards zero deviation with an almost perfect result. So players will look to get that result.

 

This golf game, all golf games have a benefit, that a perfectly straight golf swing in golf is not the goal as I already stated previously.

 

So, If we can ever agree that Zero axis, zero offset, zero deviation from swing path both back and forward is pretty much impossible free hand, the game picks these swing paths up fine from all controllers, and no one is super human, if we can come to consensus on those points the anti cheat is pretty easy to accomplish IMHO.

 

Since zero should not what a player is looking for, zero can be detected easily enough, fire zero so deep into the weeds from the first hit that a machete is needed. Simple. The best solutions are never found in complicated, they are found in simple.

 

No extra detecting software, no fancy technology required, no massive resources needed, just fire zero in some weird and wild direction.

 

DONE, now whats next?

[frank70]

Penalizing a perfect shot isn't the right way to go imho. Isn't this what we all are striving for after all? To get it perfectly right every once in a while? Sending such a shot automatically in the weeds would be a huge mistake.

 

But if you can do it two times in a row, or three times? Yes, then send it in the weeds because bare hand to replicate a perfect shot (straight swing plane, 0.25 ratio and 0 mishit heel/toe) is almost impossible to do.

 

When i am practicing on the range i get that perfect shot once in a while. Maybe 1 shot out of 50-70. But i get alot of shots with a straight swing plane and a mishit between 1-5. I would say this is a result of practice and a good control of hand/arm motion. But i am almost certain, that my play on the course is worse than that. I have way more control over my shots on the range.

 

All in all a good anti-cheat is quite difficult to do. But penalizing good shots isn't the right way to go.

[fishwicket79]

Penalizing a perfect shot isn't the right way to go imho. Isn't this what we all are striving for after all? To get it perfectly right every once in a while? Sending such a shot automatically in the weeds would be a huge mistake.

But if you can do it two times in a row, or three times? Yes, then send it in the weeds because bare hand to replicate a perfect shot (straight swing plane, 0.25 ratio and 0 mishit heel/toe) is almost impossible to do.

When i am practicing on the range i get that perfect shot once in a while. Maybe 1 shot out of 50-70. But i get alot of shots with a straight swing plane and a mishit between 1-5. I would say this is a result of practice and a good control of hand/arm motion. But i am almost certain, that my play on the course is worse than that. I have way more control over my shots on the range.

All in all a good anti-cheat is quite difficult to do. But penalizing good shots isn't the right way to go.

yep.controller is the same,I would say nigh in impossible to hit zero plane 3 times in a row unless your using an aid

[JTee1]

This is what they want to stop. Just not right in my book, but the only answer i can come up with is a handicap tour.

I know that's a dirty word for some. You cant ban or test every device, and then it would be a continual effort. I personally loved the handicaps OGT had, it was the USGA guidelines and fair but they had to go to the negative side of par because its a video game and possibly people exploiting the game. I Highlight the word possibly, not accusing. As you see below the temptation is there. I remember my Dads peach wine in the basement, I took a drink then i put the same amount of water back in. Guess what it lost its flavor and finally ruined the wine for everyone . 

Then we can all use the device of our choice. 

 

[Steve2golf]

Penalizing a perfect shot isn't the right way to go imho. Isn't this what we all are striving for after all? To get it perfectly right every once in a while? Sending such a shot automatically in the weeds would be a huge mistake.

 

But if you can do it two times in a row, or three times? Yes, then send it in the weeds because bare hand to replicate a perfect shot (straight swing plane, 0.25 ratio and 0 mishit heel/toe) is almost impossible to do.

 

When i am practicing on the range i get that perfect shot once in a while. Maybe 1 shot out of 50-70. But i get alot of shots with a straight swing plane and a mishit between 1-5. I would say this is a result of practice and a good control of hand/arm motion. But i am almost certain, that my play on the course is worse than that. I have way more control over my shots on the range.

 

All in all a good anti-cheat is quite difficult to do. But penalizing good shots isn't the right way to go.

No no, I'm not suggesting at all what the game reports, I'm suggesting what is exactly happening. The game likely has built in slight variations and will still give a zero result, which is fine. What you see being zero, is not at all a true zero. What I'm suggesting is a true zero result should be the weeds.

Theres a test somewhere that will tell you exactly how far off line you truly are when moving your control backwards and forwards, to bad I have no time to find it, but you would see how impossible it really is to get a true zero if everything is working as it should.

[mebby]

This is what they want to stop. Just not right in my book, but the only answer i can come up with is a handicap tour.

I know that's a dirty word for some. You cant ban or test every device, and then it would be a continual effort. I personally loved the handicaps OGT had, it was the USGA guidelines and fair but they had to go to the negative side of par because its a video game and possibly people exploiting the game. I Highlight the word possibly, not accusing. As you see below the temptation is there. I remember my Dads peach wine in the basement, I took a drink then i put the same amount of water back in. Guess what it lost its flavor and finally ruined the wine for everyone . 

Then we can all use the device of our choice. 

 

Yep.  This sort of software is far too easily obtained (for free) to do whatever you want to your controllers.  Why someone would use it is beyond me as it takes all the fun out of things but I suppose different people have different motivations.

[fishwicket79]

This is what they want to stop. Just not right in my book, but the only answer i can come up with is a handicap tour.
I know that's a dirty word for some. You cant ban or test every device, and then it would be a continual effort. I personally loved the handicaps OGT had, it was the USGA guidelines and fair but they had to go to the negative side of par because its a video game and possibly people exploiting the game. I Highlight the word possibly, not accusing. As you see below the temptation is there. I remember my Dads peach wine in the basement, I took a drink then i put the same amount of water back in. Guess what it lost its flavor and finally ruined the wine for everyone .
Then we can all use the device of our choice.

lol mouse boys love it don't they,all claim to be saints,makes me sick:) at least anyone with half a brain knows the score

[fishwicket79]

Yep. This sort of software is far too easily obtained (for free) to do whatever you want to your controllers. Why someone would use it is beyond me as it takes all the fun out of things but I suppose different people have different motivations.

I also struggle to get my head around people that do this,look at me I'm amazing I hit straight but oh wait I cheat lol.small minds that's all I can think of,maybe they need the attention of only the foolish thinking they are good?

[Brendan]

Why doesn't everyone who plays on OGT allow their game to be viewed through steam - this way if any OGT admin want to watch someone they can? The stream will display the game exactly as the player sees it. Not a solution in itself - but certainly a help in deterring manipulation

[Jesus Jones]

Why doesn't everyone who plays on OGT allow their game to be viewed through steam - this way if any OGT admin want to watch someone they can? The stream will display the game exactly as the player sees it. Not a solution in itself - but certainly a help in deterring manipulation

If that's the case, why can't play only be set as a match and not single play?