230 replies to this topic

[Kablammo11]

I just repeat what I had to say about the cost structure in the previous, now deleted Forums: I will gladly pay whatever it takes to play this game, I understand that I may have to pay for the game itself, then pay extra for the CourseForge, and finally pay for an online registration on top of that and maybe even once more for additional downloadable content. I'm okay with all of that, but not with a pay2win-game like WGT. That would be a deal-breaker for me.

 

If I recall AJ's comments from 3 months back, he wrote that pay2win was not an option.

 

@Maineah: I read your now removed comment and liked it. Like it as in: "enjoyed it and agreed with it "and also clicked on the "Like this" button. Looking forward to the reworded beauty you are cooking up now. 

[fungolfer]

Maybe the membership comments could be moved to a new topic by a mod? Think this is the swing meter topic. As for the costs: I will have a look on what it will cost to play. I don't mind to pay at all as long as it hasn't anything to do with advantaged gameplay (balls, clubs etc.)

[Dazmaniac]

One thing I doubt we will do is allow varying speeds of swing meter.  This opens up all sorts of potential problems.

 

Just glad to have read this snippet. The click meter definitely has to be one speed. Those worrying about age, I doubt that it will be anything like lightning fast. It may take some getting used to (hell I've used a Links 2003 click meter since late 2002) but that's all part of the game.

 

@Woodworkery - I appreciate WGT sell clubs, balls, clothes etc. but it's all gimmicky IMO. Buy 3 balls for $5 that last 5 rounds and go 15% further than standard. Buy a striped shirt for $5 and get +10% accuracy off the tee for 5 rounds. What a load of bollards, lol. Just makes WGT an arcade fest to me. Even the swing meter isn't really a swing, as the backswing requires the user to actually set the power and replicate a swing.

 

I pay an annual sub at iRacing and purchase extra cars and tracks as needed and the annual sub allows me to use their online servers as and when I please and race when I want. I personally would have no problems if PP did something similar, but I'm sure some folks would find issue with it. If they provided stock clubs, clothes etc. from the start but then in time made DLC clubsets, clothes etc. that you could purchase for a small fee then I'm good with that (and I don't mean clubs that gain you 20 yards etc. but just a new set of clubs you could add to your inventory) much like flight sims and train sims do when they release DLC planes and trains that folks can buy and use.

 

We are not all going to agree on what direction PP take when it comes to selling the product, but hey... c'est la vie!

[Keith]

I'm also totaly agree that! The most important thing for me is to have a Longtime playable Game with predictable costs

Complete agreement here also.  The idea of buying balls, apparel, etc. sounds like it could get pricey in a hurry.  I am all for paying for the game itself plus a subscription of some sort.

[Tresclub]

Has anyone actually seen what the PP swing meter is going to look like?

[Kablammo11]

Yes, Tresclub. Try the top of the first page of this thread.

[Tresclub]

Got it K... obviously missed it earlier.  Thanks!

[Davefevs]

I thought you were being sarcastic, as we'd gone off-topic!!!

[KenR]

  

On the pricing structure - we have no information yet other than already posted.  However, to SineWiz comment, if we give the game away as a free download and do not charge for offline play do you think the game would survive?  If we charge for the game so offline players pay for the product but then charge an online annual fee will that work?  There are so many ways to do this, and very few are correct.  so we will be thinking long and hard about this.

We hope to have a ball hitting demo video shortly.

 

Personally, I like the idea of a single, affordable annual subscription fee that gives the user access to the game, courses, equipment and if a user chooses, online tours, tournaments and such. As for Course Forge, I'm not sure if you want to make this a separate fee (perhaps one time only with free updates) or have a second annual subscription fee option for those that want it at a slightly higher price that includes Course Forge. Not everyone will want to use Course Forge to create courses. The idea is to keep the fee structure simple and affordable, and on an annual basis. After all, I'm sure the game will be constantly improved and upgraded with time, and we always used to purchase the "new" version of Links (for example) every year, so why would anyone object to an annual fee for the same improvements and privileges to Perfect Golf that provides the user with an ever improving game and the creators with an annual income stream that keeps the game going and rewards their hard work? 

 

Personally I abhor the idea of purchasing extra balls, clubs, apparel, etc. that in some cases gives the user extra yards off the tee, better spin rates, etc. blah, blah blah. I just don't care for that type of pricing model. Equipment and apparel should be part of and included in the game, the user chooses the equipment he/she likes and it's as simple as that. Remember, just my personal opinion, please don't blast me if you think differently.

 

Keep it simple and easy to maintain Andrew. The game is going to be a success, PP is going about this the right way and I continue to look forward to it very much.

 

Also looking forward to the swing meter video when you get around to it and seeing it in action!

[Davefevs]

As we are going a bit off topic with pricing in a swing meter thread, I've started a separate one here:

http://www.perfectpa...ideas-thoughts/

[fungolfer]

Great idea Dave

[KenR]

As we are going a bit off topic with pricing in a swing meter thread, I've started a separate one here:

http://www.perfectpa...ideas-thoughts/

 

Andrew himself commented on the pricing structure in this thread so I did not see responding to it as being off topic; however the topic was started as a comment on the swing meter I'll agree. I'd like my comments on it to be read so I suppose I should copy my post and re-post it in your new thread.

[Davefevs]

Wasnt meant to be critical in any way.....felt I was guilty of going off topic, and thought it would be easier to track.

People are free to do what they like!

Copy and past sounds a good idea.

[Davefevs]

@leeray - nicely put

[woodworkery]

PP will succeed, but you want to pay a yearly sub. and get clubs , and unlimited balls for free? Common the price would be astronomical, what would you get maybe 1000 players. 

WGT has a good set up, they are just over priced on the equipment and balls, and they control the game way to much . I know guys that are dropping $50.00 to $70.00 a month at WGT now times that by 12 months, now times that by  over 365,000 members. This looks like a great game. You mention Links, and some mention Tiger Wood this game can't compare to them. It is in fact comparable to WGT in graphics and hopefully play. The point I'm making is a lot of players are unhappy with WGT for the simple reason they (WGT) influences the game to much and use the excuse it's VEM or thats how it would be in real life. Be true to the players , don't play head game with them.

But back to the topic, what do you think the yearly sub. $500.00 or more a year. Who can afford to fork that out at one time. I am here because I am looking for an alternative to WGT. Also a lot of players are looking and watching the progress of this game. 

[woodworkery]

Sorry Dave for going off topic. Just wanted some answers on the cost. I think that is a big issue for some people including myself. Maybe a monitor of the forum could transfer my post to your new thread.

[Davefevs]

Sorry Dave for going off topic. Just wanted some answers on the cost. I think that is a big issue for some people including myself. Maybe a monitor of the forum could transfer my post to your new thread.

No-one needs to apologise to me.....I'm just enjoying being able to talk about what has the makings of a fantastic game. You might've already guessed that!!!!!

[Acrilix]

Couple of thoughts based on comments here.  

On the pricing structure - we have no information yet other than already posted.  However, to SineWiz comment, if we give the game away as a free download and do not charge for offline play do you think the game would survive?  If we charge for the game so offline players pay for the product but then charge an online annual fee will that work?  There are so many ways to do this, and very few are correct.  so we will be thinking long and hard about this.

On difficulty levels and 4 click 3 click we have made no decisions on exactly how it will work but we believe that choice is the thing that makes a game enjoyable by the masses.  So there is unlikely to be simple levels like amateur, pro champ etc but more like what you get in games like F1 where there are lots of options you can set up. eg. I want to play with 4 click, no wind meter (replaced by grass tossing) no grids, no top view aiming and so on.  This way people can customize their own difficulty.  People running tours will be able to set up the settings that can and cannot be used during the event.  

One thing I doubt we will do is allow varying speeds of swing meter.  This opens up all sorts of potential problems.  However, having said that it should be fast enough that hitting a perfect shot is not easy (it is not easy IRL) but the penalties for a missed snap should never be too severe if you only just miss.  One of my frustrations with golf games in the past is at difficult levels if you miss the snap just a little the penalty is too large and not reflective of what happens IRL if your swing is only slightly off.  We want people to be able to play it like golf.  That means you should not play by aiming down the middle and trying to hit a straight shot.  If your tendancy is to draw (or snap late) then you should be able to manage that around the golf course at all levels.  Difficulty comes in by removing aids not in making the swing meter more penal.  So take out your aiming aids, alignment aids, wind aids, distance aids, 4 click etc.

On the RTS TS swing and edging, this is why much of our swing is going to be tempo and timing based hopefully.  You can turn off your horizontal mouse movement and still hit an absolutely horrible shot.

We hope to have a ball hitting demo video shortly.

 

This post has made me more optimistic than ever that this game/simulation is still heading in the right direction. I just hope that large numbers of people who are after something else, and the potential of more $$ doesn't eventually pull this team away from their goals.

I totally agree with every game mechanic talked about here. Choices to set the difficulty without losing the realism on the hardest level is definitely the way to go. Options, and a way for the community to contribute and enhance the game are what make every great game stand the test of time. I've played far too many games where difficulty levels have been too restricting to do what I wanted to do for my enjoyment. The more things you can turn on or off to make the game easier or harder the better!